Joined: Aug '08
Location: Canada
Age: 43 (M)
Posts: 658
So we all agree every hand has to be laid down at some point. I just dont think some people understand when and id like to lay down some thoughts on the matter. There are millions of variables in every game of poker and they all come into play at some point whether we are aware or not of them. A loose player calling a bet instantly demands a different approach then a tight player calling my bet and to remain one dimensional will lead to disappointment. I read that people dont get tells online but what more is there really then betting patterns and habits? I dont use tracking software because i have enough trouble assimilating the info i already am overwhelmed with and have to sort though.
If a loose player makes a call on my AA then check raises me allin on flop what do i do? it depends. Id call if the player has shown he check raises after flatting with only top pair. Id fold if the snake is a good player but likes to fish for big hands and has shown he can make a solid check raise with two pair or better.
Do you already see the info involved. At no point ever do i click and hope. Lacking sufficient data (ie a table move to a new table) i likely call and then rely on the stakes i play hoping he has top pair or middle pair or simply wishes to move me off the pot or pretending he outflopped me. If ive not been able to see much because im multy tabling then i use my time and look for the last hand he played to a showdown. Depending on how it evolved i make my decision.
When you go allin with any hand you are making a stand. You have to want the call and cant be upset when luck turns you away. If you do not want to rely on odds you can always play the hand differently.
I hope this helps you all as much as its helped me.
Joined: Jan '10
Location: Indonesia
Age: 60 (M)
Posts: 1875
Thanks for sharing. History, table reading is really important for me to make decision, but : then i use my time and look for the last hand he played to a showdown. Depending on how it evolved i make my decision.
I usually no have time to do it. so just feeling to make decision. Without info Fold is saver and in bad luck day, no good card came again until my stake poor then get good card - all - in and lost
Joined: Aug '08
Location: Canada
Age: 43 (M)
Posts: 658
Bankrollmanagement is key Serpang. Once the money matters too much trouble ensues.
Anytime you enter the realm of hoping you're making the right move its likely already too late. Betting patterns reveal so much and if you know even a bit about the player then you can make a more informed decision. All of this doesnt account for them changing gears so just do like bruce lee does and "be water"
Joined: Mar '12
Location: United Kingdom
Age: 40 (M)
Posts: 1277
Posted by MicroMachina: So we all agree every hand has to be laid down at some point. I just dont think some people understand when and id like to lay down some thoughts on the matter. There are millions of variables in every game of poker and they all come into play at some point whether we are aware or not of them. A loose player calling a bet instantly demands a different approach then a tight player calling my bet and to remain one dimensional will lead to disappointment. I read that people dont get tells online but what more is there really then betting patterns and habits? I dont use tracking software because i have enough trouble assimilating the info i already am overwhelmed with and have to sort though.
If a loose player makes a call on my AA then check raises me allin on flop what do i do? it depends. Id call if the player has shown he check raises after flatting with only top pair. Id fold if the snake is a good player but likes to fish for big hands and has shown he can make a solid check raise with two pair or better.
Do you already see the info involved. At no point ever do i click and hope. Lacking sufficient data (ie a table move to a new table) i likely call and then rely on the stakes i play hoping he has top pair or middle pair or simply wishes to move me off the pot or pretending he outflopped me. If ive not been able to see much because im multy tabling then i use my time and look for the last hand he played to a showdown. Depending on how it evolved i make my decision.
When you go allin with any hand you are making a stand. You have to want the call and cant be upset when luck turns you away. If you do not want to rely on odds you can always play the hand differently.
I hope this helps you all as much as its helped me.
Good luck to all and i hope your hands hold.
Great post.
This pertains to hands from AA to 34off.
It's as much about the player as the cards they hold - some players will lay down the winning hand because they feel beat. 90% won't however - but if you have a read on a particular person, you can adjust strategy and hand range and the whole kit and kaboodle.
In reference to your AA scenario...
Regardless of player shoving you obviously want to avoid trips a flush+straight draw and two pairs.
I agree that it's never wise to just shove because you have the pre-flop nut hand - aces get beaten often and care needs to be taken.
The board texture is key for me as well - however against loose players its often tough to asses whether they have hit hard or not. There's nothing more sickening than loosing your stack on a Jc2s5d to find your aces are now getting beat by a loose 52suited.
I'm finding a lot of bad players, even in tournaments when the blinds are quite high and in the face of raises play 'TV hands' hoping they will catch the flush with 82 of spades (this happened to me today actually, I had AA, they had 82 spades...you know what happened.
When muli-tabling it is so difficult to take everything in though - the best thing is sit at the table for 10-15 minutes scouting the players while playing solid hands.
Joined: Oct '11
Location: Canada
Age: 57 (M)
Posts: 115
Nice post Micro food for thought.. I do have problems laying good hands down some times and have payed dearly for it..Thx for the post always good stuff...
Joined: Mar '12
Location: Netherlands
Age: 51 (M)
Posts: 617
to add some on the above :
depending how deep and how hard you need chips is also important how to play your monsters,, at least that's what i do..
if you limp with A-A ,K-K ,A-K its very likey that some players will call with no mather what crap they start the hand with...and more players in that hands will decrease your chances to win that hand.
on the other startinghands with Q-Q ,J-J,A-Q ,A-J its mostly wise ,also depending on how hard you need chips to not shuff preflop, because if you miss and someone holds a better hand like the ones above or hit a set,straight,flush or flushdraw...in most scenario's your toasted. and might get knocked out,,while u where runnning so good and deep..
I think this is not standard for all situations,,because an sng is diff then an MTT how many tables are left?? how many players are left how many at your table? 4 or 9 handed all these should mather on your opproach how to play a hand..
So i agree , be like bruce lee,, like water,,
I myself compare playing poker with playing the arcade game ; PACMAN most of u will know that game..
My credo is: Don't mess with the ghost how are chasing u, just eat those dots and stay out of trouble,,if u do jou reach your goals and clear the field easy.. if u don't, the ghost will get u and u die..
Joined: May '09
Location: Spain
Age: 49 (M)
Posts: 1331
Really you don´t use soft, Micromachina? Are usefull for the situation you post. Yes, sometimes too much info is worst than no have it but is easy with a little time know who to manage it.
How many notes you had from regular players? Thousands, i´m sure.
