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  30-Jul-12, 22:08   #1
Best way to play micro? 0 
mcmasterful 
Joined: Mar '12
Location: Canada
Age: 43 (M)
Posts: 8
I have tried many time to play micro, and i never seem to get it right, ever. I have tried loose and tight, and patient. But nothin works.

Can any give a breif summary an a solid fundimental way of playing it ( so i can tweak it a bit to my like liking ) or throw me an article?

Thanks Smile

     
  30-Jul-12, 22:30   #2
  0 
erru9107 
Joined: Oct '11
Location: Sweden
Age: 25 (M)
Posts: 910
Personally, I'd play it tight. If you're starting to get bored (which is most likely the case why that strategy didn't work out for you), just start playing more tables at a time. That way you'll get more action and you won't get bored as easily.

     
  30-Jul-12, 22:51   #3
  +3 
Setera 
Joined: May '11
Location: Belgium
Age: 27 (M)
Posts: 117
Well theres only one simple and best rule. whether you play a wide range or a tight range.
my rules on playing micro stakes:

1: Never bluff! Never ever bluff! (Only C-bet is allowed)
2: Open as many hands as you like. (obviously not 40%+) But if you open. always come with a 3x raise. Never limp!
3: If you are not sure you have the best hand. Like top pair and bad kicker... Keep the pot small. Don't make stupid bets to increase the pot unnecesarely.
4: Try to play in position. If you called a raiser and he checks 2 times to you. Maka a 50% bet. You'll pick it up at least 70%+ of the times.
5: Never ever float! The players here bluff to often to make that noticably profitable. Unless you have a tell obviously. (floating to steal the pot later is a losing strategy here.)
6: If you open raised a pot. Always C-bet if you got no showdown value (headsup.) Give up on the hand in 3-x way pots.
7: Always raise or call a pocket pair. ( not reraise, if someone else raised jsut call.) Make sure he has around 40-100+ BBs. These tend to be very profitable. just set mine.
8: Probably a big money saver here! Always fold to a 3bet. People don't 3bet light here. (only somethimes do so on the button or hijack with AQ+. I instantly muck AJ up to 99's.
=> AJ etc if you hit yuo either lose big or win small.
=> 99's 1 overpair and you don't know where you stand. only set makes you comfortable playing postflop (in lowstakes).
So just avoid these troubles and lose your 3BB's of a raise, no big deal.

If this doesn't make your profitable then I don't know... Main money losers are calling 3bets, or 4betting with AK AQ 99 1010 and stuff. they'll most likely even shove on you and you are more often the underdog, making the high variance and certainly not profitable.

Lastly: If you got a great hand or set or very strong hand. Either you trap (if he is the aggressor, they love to bluff, and they are tempted to do that even more if theres a decent amount in the middle Smile
And if you are the raiser and hit top pair or set or whatever. Don't slowplay it when he checks it to you. Just best, if he hits top pair or anything he'll call you down the whole way. If the board gets ugly slow down. but make sure you call, this might make you look weak, chances he bluffs.

pretty much my take on the micro stakes. You can train this strategy very well in rush/speed or zoom poker.
(This strategy is currently even working at 0.10/0.20 ) The reason for that is. I and I alone decide the size of the pots. I win small pots, lose small pots. BUT I win big pots when i hit hard. Low variance. and many hands due the speed/rush/zoom.
Once you play against insanely aggressive light 3betters, this strategy won't work anymore. as you'll bleed too many chips until you hit a hand.

Hope this helped you out sir.

     
  30-Jul-12, 23:03   #4
  0 
mcmasterful 
Joined: Mar '12
Location: Canada
Age: 43 (M)
Posts: 8
Actually this was exactly what i was looking for Smile Thank you for putting the time into typing this, these are the guidelines i will use almosty 100% of the time.


Thank you setera

i feel Dollar Dollar Dollar coming on with this method Smile

     
  31-Jul-12, 05:42   #5
  0 
Macubaas 
Joined: Apr '11
Location: Romania
Age: 27 (M)
Posts: 6668
Definately playing tight is the secret on micros, the worst thing you can do there is to make bluffs!

There you can lose most of the times. Also when you you have a good hand, you raise preflop and if you do not hit the flop post a 1.2 pot cbet, if you get paid most of the times you are behind.

     
  31-Jul-12, 07:18   #6
  0 
ayaraled 
Joined: Apr '11
Location: Philippines
Age: 39 (M)
Posts: 544
Nice strategy there setera..Very details and easy to read. I will try this if it works for me...been losing in cash game micro stakes in yachting lately...

     
  31-Jul-12, 10:59   #7
  0 
TheMachineQC 

Joined: Apr '10
Location: Canada
Age: 27 (M)
Posts: 2121
I agree with this strategy, that's pretty much how I play too. And I agree with the rule number 1: never bluff with air (except c-bets). But there's one thing I do quite often that is not mentioned in that strategy: The semibluffs. I think you can semi-bluff sometimes with good open handed straight draws and nut flush draws mostly, especially when you have a tight image. This is usually a profitable play because the calling stations and donks can easily just call with mid pair and hit 2 pairs or something when you make your draw, or just hit a smaller flush/straight and in this case you're gonna get paid.

But of course you don't have to play your good draws this way more than 50% of the time, you can also just check/call those. Pick your spots!

Edited by TheMachineQC (Tuesday, July 31, 2012 @ 11:05 GMT)


     
  31-Jul-12, 11:57   #8
  0 
Fakiry 

Joined: Apr '09
Location: Portugal
Age: 37 (M)
Posts: 4764
You say you’ve tried everything and nothing worked, either you “tried” it for a short time or you’re doing something wrong. Playing in micros has the inconvenient of being able to find every type of players. There will be those who are playing for the first time, those who are exploding no deposit bónus, the regulars who bet few bucks a month on those levels only to have fun and those who really try to build up a bankroll since the no deposit bónus. Being able to battle against such complex field isn’t easy. You always need patience. Then, you should try to study each oponente at the table. You should pay attention to the hands you don’t play to try to understand how others react in situations where you’re not involved. Then, mix between loose (when having better hands and more chips) and tight (when leading or when lower than most opponents).

     
  31-Jul-12, 11:58   #9
  0 
IslandJack 

Joined: Oct '09
Location: Belgium
Age: 53 (M)
Posts: 2847
Posted by Setera:
Well theres only one simple and best rule. whether you play a wide range or a tight range.
my rules on playing micro stakes:

1: Never bluff! Never ever bluff! (Only C-bet is allowed)
2: Open as many hands as you like. (obviously not 40%+) But if you open. always come with a 3x raise. Never limp!
3: If you are not sure you have the best hand. Like top pair and bad kicker... Keep the pot small. Don't make stupid bets to increase the pot unnecesarely.
4: Try to play in position. If you called a raiser and he checks 2 times to you. Maka a 50% bet. You'll pick it up at least 70%+ of the times.
5: Never ever float! The players here bluff to often to make that noticably profitable. Unless you have a tell obviously. (floating to steal the pot later is a losing strategy here.)
6: If you open raised a pot. Always C-bet if you got no showdown value (headsup.) Give up on the hand in 3-x way pots.
7: Always raise or call a pocket pair. ( not reraise, if someone else raised jsut call.) Make sure he has around 40-100+ BBs. These tend to be very profitable. just set mine.
8: Probably a big money saver here! Always fold to a 3bet. People don't 3bet light here. (only somethimes do so on the button or hijack with AQ+. I instantly muck AJ up to 99's.
=> AJ etc if you hit yuo either lose big or win small.
=> 99's 1 overpair and you don't know where you stand. only set makes you comfortable playing postflop (in lowstakes).
So just avoid these troubles and lose your 3BB's of a raise, no big deal.

If this doesn't make your profitable then I don't know... Main money losers are calling 3bets, or 4betting with AK AQ 99 1010 and stuff. they'll most likely even shove on you and you are more often the underdog, making the high variance and certainly not profitable.

Lastly: If you got a great hand or set or very strong hand. Either you trap (if he is the aggressor, they love to bluff, and they are tempted to do that even more if theres a decent amount in the middle Smile
And if you are the raiser and hit top pair or set or whatever. Don't slowplay it when he checks it to you. Just best, if he hits top pair or anything he'll call you down the whole way. If the board gets ugly slow down. but make sure you call, this might make you look weak, chances he bluffs.

pretty much my take on the micro stakes. You can train this strategy very well in rush/speed or zoom poker.
(This strategy is currently even working at 0.10/0.20 ) The reason for that is. I and I alone decide the size of the pots. I win small pots, lose small pots. BUT I win big pots when i hit hard. Low variance. and many hands due the speed/rush/zoom.


Hope this helped you out sir.


VERY nice ! +1

Pretty much what I do, works well.
As to this:
"Once you play against insanely aggressive light 3betters, this strategy won't work anymore. as you'll bleed too many chips until you hit a hand."

Here you have to tighten up completely, or you WILL lose too many chips, like setera says.
Uber tight is then the rule, and just play aggro (or trap if you feel it right) with AA KK, sometimes QQ when you get them.
Don't be afraid to dump them if called on a higher flop. (ie. KK with an A on the board).
Many make the mistake of shoving there when they are already beat.

And yep, in Zoom this works fine. Blink

     
  31-Jul-12, 14:44   #10
  0 
Setera 
Joined: May '11
Location: Belgium
Age: 27 (M)
Posts: 117
@ mcmasterful :
You are very welcome sir. If you obey those simply very open guidelines I gave you will run profits. Just keep in mind, there is always variance in poker. Meaning you might lose up to 3 buy-ins even when you play perfect. but this way it won't happen very often. You play pretty much with small profits. Until someone plays bad when you hit hard, or have AA KK QQ.

Also a small extra hint. don't over play AJ-AK don't 3-bet with them. In these micro stakes people love to play bad and get there money in with horrendous cards as 88-1010 or even AJ or lower PP's and you'll be coinflipping.. (Coinflips are not profitable! NEVER due the rake.)

Last but not least. Stop when you got a bad beat. Most players mentalitty is so bad in low stakes or as new players you'll end up doing big mistakes or bluffs making you 'pure losses' What I mean by that is. All those losses will have to be caught back by pure winnings. So basicly 1 big mistakes, costs you many hours extra of grinding to gain it back.

@macubaas:
Yes exactly correct. When I C-bet I make a 50-60% bet. In headsup situation, if your C-bet works 50% of the time. you will already make small profit in long run.


@ayaraled:
I hope it works! good luck on those tables. I've played in yachting for a while, just look out for the grinders out there, but don't be scared either. the rest will literally give you the money.

scared money = losing money Blink And if you aren't sure on the river you should bet or check no matter you are in position or not. Always always check. This way you can't be put to the annoying Re-raise. And if they bet. You'll just call the bet you would have potentially made. (+ chances on bluff moneys.)


@TheMachineQC
Well on those semi-bluffs. It really depends for me. After the C-bet I often see how many actual outs I have and or I think my opponant has a strong hand that would make me money if I hit.
If I know I would get paid off. I just bet a rather mediocre bet to just get the pot a little bigger, so bigger pay out on river or a loss on the river. (As statistically I'd be fine giving up on the hand, as chances were he'd folded more than often enough on my first 2 bets.)

The biggest losses are made on the river. So making your decisions easy for the river are very profitable. In my experience.




If any further questions I'll be glad to help out. with my vision on low stakes.
Shoot. I'm even prepared to run some tables together and help you over skype or whatever.
Afterall learning from eachother makes you a better player.


     
  31-Jul-12, 14:58   #11
  0 
erru9107 
Joined: Oct '11
Location: Sweden
Age: 25 (M)
Posts: 910
That's a Thumbs Up for you Setera! A really nice guide which is pretty much how I play and that works perfectly! I do have some small modifications for it since I play fixed limit but the general idea still applies.

     
  31-Jul-12, 17:06   #12
  0 
pochui 

Joined: May '08
Location: Lithuania
Age: 32 (M)
Posts: 8648
Posted by Setera:
2: Open as many hands as you like. (obviously not 40%+) But if you open. always come with a 3x raise. Never limp!

not sure about this one, if a table is not aggressive i think limping into many pots with even trash holdings might be a decent idea, first of all with constant limping you hide your range (in a way same as constant 3 betting) and secondly you see the pots more cheaply than constantly raising, sure you do not steal the blinds, this is the only negative...

     
  31-Jul-12, 17:21   #13
  0 
Setera 
Joined: May '11
Location: Belgium
Age: 27 (M)
Posts: 117
Posted by pochui:
Posted by Setera:
2: Open as many hands as you like. (obviously not 40%+) But if you open. always come with a 3x raise. Never limp!

not sure about this one, if a table is not aggressive i think limping into many pots with even trash holdings might be a decent idea, first of all with constant limping you hide your range (in a way same as constant 3 betting) and secondly you see the pots more cheaply than constantly raising, sure you do not steal the blinds, this is the only negative...


Well that approach works. However a better player behind you will always isolate you and you'll play out of position.
This might work for you and I've seen many players do this.

Why I think this is bad play:
- First of all the isolation.
- You invite many more players in behind you insanely decreasing your chances of winning the pot. If you got a pocket pair and hit a set. You got no clue where you stand as its multiway. (Here there's a saying, Don't go broke on a limped pot. This might happen to you if you hit set or lower street or 2 pairs.)
- You hide your range way less. In these stakes, they don't know about ranges. Only a few keep that in mind imo. (You limp normal hands and good hands? But you then also raise terrible hands and good hands? Sound not that profitable to me.) As your AA you limped can easely get cracked by 25o. Win small lose big.
- Constantly 3x'ing they know a range of you for example 20-25% is my range. I often just pick up the pot any where I am. And rarely 25o gets to see a flop.

So for me always raising makes it way more profitable.
Again I don't say your way doesn't work, but I think it's harder to play. (Might turn out way more profitable if you master it. dont' know, but i'm surely not gonna try that Smile.

Lastly with speed/rush/zoom poker thats an absolute waste. You get to multiway pots and always atleast a pot. Making your Hands/minute sooo much lower. and over XXXXX amount of hands, you can see your avg profit over 100hands. So basicly if you do the maths, I think raising/folding that hand instead of limping is more profitable, just because your hands/minute will increase substantially.
Not to mention your patience won't run empty, or get frustrated getting to lose a bigger pot limped than you wanted.


     
  31-Jul-12, 17:32   #14
  0 
pochui 

Joined: May '08
Location: Lithuania
Age: 32 (M)
Posts: 8648
Posted by Setera:
Why I think this is bad play:
- You invite many more players in behind you insanely decreasing your chances of winning the pot. If you got a pocket pair and hit a set. You got no clue where you stand as its multiway. (Here there's a saying, Don't go broke on a limped pot. This might happen to you if you hit set or lower street or 2 pairs.)

actually if you carefully pick your range ( i go for chasing top flushes -A anything suited, sometimes top draws- A10-AK...yep it's hard to play with sets...) many players behind you in the pot is exact situation you want- since they increase the pot, and eventually some of them end up paying you off, when you hit your big hands...


------------
Posted by Setera:
Lastly with speed/rush/zoom poker thats an absolute waste. You get to multiway pots and always atleast a pot. Making your Hands/minute sooo much lower. and over XXXXX amount of hands, you can see your avg profit over 100hands. So basicly if you do the maths, I think raising/folding that hand instead of limping is more profitable, just because your hands/minute will increase substantially.

completely agree Thumbs Up

     
  31-Jul-12, 18:58   #15
  0 
Setera 
Joined: May '11
Location: Belgium
Age: 27 (M)
Posts: 117
As you mention your limp play, it does work out indeed. There are beginners increasing the pot and when you hit continuing their bluff. thats a great source of income indeed Smile


to all others... GREAT SUCCES AT THE TABLES!!

     
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