Joined: Mar '11
Location: Croatia
Age: 43 (M)
Posts: 1738
This hand was when 14 players were left and this 90 ppl sngs pay from the top 12. So Im 5th in chips and im sitting on the immediate right to the chip leader. This guy is a total calling station, the problem is i saw him get lucky on the table one too many times already. this was what happened:
PokerStars Hand #86241095199: Tournament #614906009, $1.08+$0.27+$0.15 USD Hold'em No Limit - Level VII (125/250) - 2012/09/16 3:02:27 CET [2012/09/15 21:02:27 ET] Table '614906009 10' 9-max Seat #7 is the button Seat 3: lukasema2 (10902 in chips) Seat 4: serega311113 (25368 in chips) Seat 5: Thiago UFOP (12115 in chips) Seat 6: PokerKoter (13967 in chips) Seat 7: steph crum (21059 in chips) Seat 8: RedFlashhh (5522 in chips) Seat 9: nei2301 (8205 in chips) lukasema2: posts the ante 25 serega311113: posts the ante 25 Thiago UFOP: posts the ante 25 PokerKoter: posts the ante 25 steph crum: posts the ante 25 RedFlashhh: posts the ante 25 nei2301: posts the ante 25 RedFlashhh: posts small blind 125 nei2301: posts big blind 250 *** HOLE CARDS *** Dealt to lukasema2 [Kh Ks] lukasema2: raises 750 to 1000 serega311113: calls 1000 Thiago UFOP: folds PokerKoter: folds steph crum: folds RedFlashhh: folds nei2301: calls 750 *** FLOP *** [3h 2h Qc] nei2301: checks lukasema2: bets 1500 serega311113: calls 1500 nei2301: folds *** TURN *** [3h 2h Qc] lukasema2: bets 1500 serega311113: raises 12000 to 13500 lukasema2: folds Uncalled bet (12000) returned to serega311113 serega311113 collected 9300 from pot serega311113: doesn't show hand
Felt sick the way i played this out... stupid bet on the turn and that reraise even if its not a Q in hand just f***** it up completely.
Joined: Oct '10
Location: Malta
Age: 43 (M)
Posts: 44
Kid of hard to say. It is really up to the fact if you believed he would shove with the nuts rather than try to make a raise you might call. Looks like he was trying to make you fold a flush draw due to the size of your continuation bet. Personally I would say it was a +EV disciplined fold either way due to flush draw and QQ so good work.
Hard to say like Wozza said but most likley it was the right fold, folds like this are what keep most of us in tourney running for the cash and keep the greedy ones out of the games, at this point i would of put my opponant on A-Q maybe even A-Q of hearts.
Joined: Jan '11
Location: United States
Age: 60 (M)
Posts: 3361
If you fold a hand and do it to stay in the game to make the final table I wouldn't be to hard on yourself. Wozza and fatal provide good support statements for you, but just as far as advice goes I never regret folding a hand that I didn't have the nuts on in the first place. I know I'm not good enough to provide a right or wrong analysis, but I do know when I fold a hand to stay alive I try not to think I did the wrong thing.
Joined: Mar '12
Location: United Kingdom
Age: 40 (M)
Posts: 1277
Definitely foldable.
You're not gonna beat any queen. Sure he might not have had jt, but you'd have needed a hero call to win and there wasn'tenough info really to give it away.
On the face of it i don't see them max shoving without a q or having hit a fullhouse maybe with pp.
He wanted you to call as opposed to raising you out the pot.
I don't believe the villain had a Q. I believe your reluctant bet of 1500 at turn into a pot of around 7000 made your opponent think that you are not comfortable with your hand and that you are trying to play pot-control. So, he used the size of his stack to bluff you. Anyway, on these limits and with this board, KK is an instashove or call all-in.
Joined: Apr '09
Location: Australia
Age: 40 (M)
Posts: 6483
As played the fold ain't bad.. But it shouldn't have even been a decision, you should have pot-committed yourself already. Your flop and turn bets are far to small. Next time bet-size better and make a commitment decision BEFORE you bet on the turn - only bet if you plan to NEVER fold, otherwise you just donating chips by making a really weak bet and then folding to the re-raise.
Joined: Mar '11
Location: Canada
Age: 44 (M)
Posts: 1490
Posted by jessthehuman: As played the fold ain't bad.. But it shouldn't have even been a decision, you should have pot-committed yourself already. Your flop and turn bets are far to small. Next time bet-size better and make a commitment decision BEFORE you bet on the turn - only bet if you plan to NEVER fold, otherwise you just donating chips by making a really weak bet and then folding to the re-raise.
Exactly this. You make a 4BB raise, which puts about what, 14BB into the pot with the dead money? 2/3 pot bet OTF means around 24BB on the turn with around 25BB left in your stack, no reason you're not either shipping it or checking OTT. Your bets are WAY to small. I'd say with all the dead money pre, even your PF raise is too small.
I don't think folding here's a good fold tbh. Wjat realistic hands do we see beating us here that'd be calling pre? AQ, KQ, Q10+ and AA. Sure villain could be holding 22 or 33 as well, but most people tend to tighten up around the bubble, so I just don't see them holding 22 or 33 unless they are a total lagtard.
On that note, any thinking player would be 3-betting something like AQ , I know I definitely would be on the bubble.
That said, villains shipping it near the bubble, which does tend to lead me to believe he's got something he feels is worth committing with. Still, you're beating so much of what he could be taking this line with. He very well could be playing something like 1010, and on the turn figures you don't have a queen and so he ships it. This is thinking beyond level 1, where you have to think of what your OPPONENT thinks YOU have.
Edited by retribution (17 September 2012 @ 08:50 GMT)
Joined: Mar '11
Location: Croatia
Age: 43 (M)
Posts: 1738
Thx for the replies guys. @ Jess And Retri, usually i would have called and if it was earlier in the tournament I guess we would know what was he holding after all. The thing is i was seeing this guy calling preflop all the time and getting lucky too often with hands like Q4, J7 so he COULD be holding anything... I dont know, even for him the call preflop was too fast and casual and the one on the flop also. Just smelled funny.. that's why i hate my bet on the turn... the hand just slipped away from me and also did half my stack
Well anyway, i did manage to triple up a couple of hands later and held so so in the finl table for some time. In the end it was actually this guy that kicked me out on a race with my 77 falling to his AQ s. 5th place... was not great but cant complain i guess the 6th place feels worst
Joined: Mar '11
Location: Canada
Age: 44 (M)
Posts: 1490
Posted by Mysik86: It was a good fold in my opinion... The most important things are: - you still in tournament - you have STRONG chances that you will be cashed BTW, how this tournament end? You cashed? You lose before cash? Or maybe you won this tournament?
I'd have to disagree with this. Losing half your stack on the bubble is a pretty bad spot to be in. In MTT'S, it's irrelevant how often you min-cash. You want to be eyeing top 3-4 spots, as that's where the bulk of the prize pool is. IMO KK is a monster hand, and you should be happily getting it in against someone. You want to be attacking and abusing weaker players, so that you've got the stack to make the FT.
Posted by lukasb: Well anyway, i did manage to triple up a couple of hands later and held so so in the finl table for some time. In the end it was actually this guy that kicked me out on a race with my 77 falling to his AQ s. 5th place... was not great but cant complain i guess the 6th place feels worst
