Joined: Jan '12
Location: Australia
Age: 30 (M)
Posts: 155
I was playing a load of these which deviates from my regular MTT lost quiet a bit of money as i got tilted and was running incredibly badly from a previous cooler set over set on flop JJs vs QQs fucking sucks. Anyway, what i find in 30% of the games i just cant win no matter what i do how i adjust if i wait it and manage to get my money in good he will make some miracle cards to win its redicolous. However, I notice the opposite happens to me where i cant do anything wrong in 30% of my games and make amazing runs of cards only ever having to value bet and not having to bluff at all. Poker does not come any easier than that. And unless i get crazy out of line i cant loose.
It also amazes me how players will think their skilled because they made 7 or 8 top pair hands out of 10 against second best or hands that caught showdown value that saw a flop. Geez, even Victor Bloom and Phil ivey the worlds best heads up players will lose money to people like this in the shorterm. How can you beat someone for profit when there getting AAs,KKs,QQs,AKs, and flopping other monsters with their marginal ones in the space of 50 or so hands against someone who refuses to fold these hands when you are making second best hands or flopping nothing? Tell me please. You cant its impossible to not lose at least some money. Then i notice you have your 40% of games where skill will ultimately prevail both opponents will have their share of good and bad hands and ultimately whoever plays their cards better will win.
Am the only one who notices this? This is not a tiltl tirade thread or anything just a simple question with a summary of my findings added. Anyone who has played these games i will appreciate your opinions or your experiences.
Edited by Redvulture61 (20 September 2012 @ 18:28 GMT)
Joined: Sep '12
Location: Romania
Age: 33 (M)
Posts: 1052
Posted by Redvulture61: I was playing a load of these which deviates from my regular MTT lost quiet a bit of money as i got tilted and was running incredibly badly from a previous cooler set over set on flop JJs vs QQs fucking sucks. Anyway, what i find in 30% of the games i just cant win no matter what i do how i adjust if i wait it and manage to get my money in good he will make some miracle cards to win its redicolous. However, I notice the opposite happens to me where i cant do anything wrong in 30% of my games and make amazing runs of cards only ever having to value bet and not having to bluff at all. Poker does not come any easier than that. And unless i get crazy out of line i cant loose.
It also amazes me how players will think their skilled because they made 7 or 8 top pair hands out of 10 against second best or hands that caught showdown value that saw a flop. Geez, even Victor Bloom and Phil ivey the worlds best heads up players will lose money to people like this in the shorterm. How can you beat someone for profit when there getting AAs,KKs,QQs,AKs, and flopping other monsters with their marginal ones in the space of 50 or so hands against someone who refuses to fold these hands when you are making second best hands or flopping nothing? Tell me please. You cant its impossible to not lose at least some money. Then i notice you have your 40% of games where skill will ultimately prevail both opponents will have their share of good and bad hands and ultimately whoever plays their cards better will win.
Am the only one who notices this? This is not a tiltl tirade thread or anything just a simple question with a summary of my findings added. Anyone who has played these games i will appreciate your opinions or your experiences.
If you play on stars is absolute normal because Jokerstars want rake ... rake and rake... if you're on a satelit with 2000chips and adversars have 10.000 or 15.000 chips and you go all in with any pair, even AA vs xx you lose... why ? for rake i hope you understood
Joined: Apr '09
Location: Australia
Age: 40 (M)
Posts: 6483
Ignore the post above, he is just another idiot.
Regarding HUSNGs the variance is freaking huge.. In any single game (or even a run of 10) the luck factor is extremely significant. Since you're paying blinds literally every hand, if you go card-dead you're basically f*cked.
Winning HUSNG players generally have fairly low ROIs - it's a high variance game and you'll never have a huge edge. I'm not a regular player, but I would imagine if you were planning to build a roll on these, you would want at least 100BIs to sustain the down-swings.
Likewise, you'll sometimes hit runs where you're the one on the heater, handing out coolers and catching monster flops etc.
Joined: Aug '11
Location: Portugal
Age: 39 (M)
Posts: 232
Yep.. variance variance variance. True what jess said.. best regular HUSNG have like 4%-7% rois .. which is quite good. It's a game where it's fairly more fun to play, coz you are always in action even if your folding your analyzing your opponent but ye, you have days where variance catches you and you think your cursed. I'm currently almost only playing HUSNG and it's amazing tbh.. for me the most annoying thing is.. that it's so common that you break even, i mean you win and lose.. then with rake you break even, annoying. But theorically it's a good way to make money. For what i''ve experienced tho, if you have the patience the best way to make quick bucks is by cleaning donks at cash :\
Joined: Sep '12
Location: Romania
Age: 33 (M)
Posts: 1052
Posted by jessthehuman: Ignore the post above, he is just another idiot.
Regarding HUSNGs the variance is freaking huge.. In any single game (or even a run of 10) the luck factor is extremely significant. Since you're paying blinds literally every hand, if you go card-dead you're basically f*cked.
Winning HUSNG players generally have fairly low ROIs - it's a high variance game and you'll never have a huge edge. I'm not a regular player, but I would imagine if you were planning to build a roll on these, you would want at least 100BIs to sustain the down-swings.
Likewise, you'll sometimes hit runs where you're the one on the heater, handing out coolers and catching monster flops etc.
YOU GOD OF POKER, sorry but that was just my opinion :| Don't need insults... i really understand.. wish you a good day
yeah jovica is killing them- he is playing $7 & $15 i believe, at least last time i had a look at sharkscope and he is still in the leaderboard for hu $5-16 for the year! really impressive with just under $6000 of profit. i like hu action but i find that i am lost with multi-tabling them, which kinda makes them a low vpp generator for me...
Joined: Apr '09
Location: Australia
Age: 40 (M)
Posts: 6483
Posted by pochui: i like hu action but i find that i am lost with multi-tabling them, which kinda makes them a low vpp generator for me...
That's true - but I wouldn't worry that much, I know Jovica only single tables. Your profit is a lot more important than your VIP rewards.. Unless you're at LEAST super nova on stars, the VPPs aren't worth s**t anyway.. I think with platinum or something it's maybe around 20% rb, nothing fantastic.
Unless you're trying to get Super Nova rewards (which are actually pretty good in terms of VIP bonuses and 'rakeback'). Pretty much all other stars VIP levels are mostly crap and I wouldn't really worry about generating VPPs, since all it means anyway is that you're paying more rake.
Joined: Apr '11
Location: Romania
Age: 35 (M)
Posts: 6669
As always Jess is right, these games have a huge variance, it's like playing PLO zoom/rush...
But still Jovi is an example that with determination it can be learned and it can be profitable, but you need a healthy bankroll to start playing HU SNG!
Joined: May '08
Location: Netherlands
Age: 53 (M)
Posts: 6197
Posted by jessthehuman:
Posted by doomdy: I smell a rigtard thread Its allways nice to have rigtards threads Bring them back them rigtards I fokin luv rigtards
Rigtards Forever
Good to see you've been back and posting again last few days, where did you disappear to???
Was extremely bussy with company, had no poker drive, when i did i ended up asleep blinded out or so tired with no patience and spewing allin with any pair. So no poker atm for me absolutely no patience
Joined: May '12
Location: United Kingdom
Age: 38 (M)
Posts: 2064
I recently had a sustained spell of playing HUSNG's... actually they were Hyper-Turbo, so they were basically just a case of getting your chips in, and quickly... and assuming you get called around 60% of the time (which seems about right from my experience) You need to be about a 40% fave on average to turn a profit.... So there is MASSIVE variance, but overall, good solid plays will prevail eventually. Variance can only be reduced by playing multiple tables... and like you say, it's very tricky to multi-table HUs. So they will always have the highest variance of any type of poker.
......I actually won 68% of them..... but ended up down cash. Partly because rake hits you hard on the HUs.... and partly because I was (foolishly) mixing $1.50 & $3.50 buy-ins, despite not having the bankroll to sustain them.... and it just so happened I did better ITM wise on the $1.50 than the $3.50.
As for the 'rake hunting' comments..... Poker sites make rake. And s**t loads of it...... GUARANTEED. Whether AA loses to KK or not is irrelevant to them. They have made their money the moment the tourney starts.... They have nothing to gain by 'rigging' anything - and have FAR too much to lose...... But we all know that anyway
i hope you understood
