Joined: Oct '11
Location: Sweden
Age: 32 (M)
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So, I'm not really sure what type of player I am so I'm usually playing one type of game one session and the next session I play another type of game. That's a good thing but I do have one problem: bankroll management. I usually have a general rule of 20 buy-ins no matter what type of game it is. But I know that's not the best way to aproach it. So I'd like to apply one type of bankroll management for every type of game meaning I'll change for every session. So here's what I figure, let me know what you think!
HU SnG's: 100 SnG's: 50 DoN SnG's: 25 MT SnG's: 75 MTT's: 100 Cash: 20
Posted by erru9107: So, I'm not really sure what type of player I am so I'm usually playing one type of game one session and the next session I play another type of game. That's a good thing but I do have one problem: bankroll management. I usually have a general rule of 20 buy-ins no matter what type of game it is. But I know that's not the best way to aproach it. So I'd like to apply one type of bankroll management for every type of game meaning I'll change for every session. So here's what I figure, let me know what you think!
HU SnG's: 100 SnG's: 50 DoN SnG's: 25 MT SnG's: 75 MTT's: 100 Cash: 20
Your cash buy ins are way too low. You should have at least 200 buy ins for cash games to cover really bad downswings.
As for the others, I'd at least double them to be safe.
was taught 300 buy ins and if one drops below 200 to drop down and build back up to 300+ before moving up. This is considered safe so one doesn't go broke.So at NL2 the buy in is .40x300=$120. Just keep doing the math for every level and u should be fine, chances are you'll start out at NL10 and see how it goes from there. If you happen to drop down to $80 you'll have to start over at NL2 to build back up. This is how bankroll management was explained to me.
200 buy ins for cash games? This means to play on 2NL you should need 400$ ? I think that's a little bit tight in my opinion.
I would suggest on the micro limits playing NL, you should need 25 buy ins, and move down every time you have 25 buy ins for the other level.
So move up to 5NL when you have 125$ but move down to 2NL when you only have 50$. This gives you enough room for downswings and keeps you safe to continue on lower levels...
This only counts for micro NL !! If you move up the ladder (which I hope you do quickly !!) You need to get tighter with the BRM. When you're playing 100NL you'll play against a lot of regulars and you need at least 50 buy in's to keep the swings under control.
If you decide to go and play other forms of poker (Plo, Draw, Stud), be sure to multiply your Buy-in requirements by 3 even 4 times, since these forms of poker are much more prone to have big swings.
The most important thing about bankrollmanagement is to know when to move down, not when to move up in levels. This will make sure that you're never going to go bust.
I would suggest on the micro limits playing NL, you should need 25 buy ins, and move down every time you have 25 buy ins for the other level.
$2NL is the lowest you can possibly go, so how do you go down from there if you hit a bad streak ?
True, but I think if a player isn't beating 2NL he should first learn the game more (even learn from his mistakes) and get a fresh start (there are always new ways to get a bankroll). If you hit a bad streak and lose 25 buy ins, to me that's not a bad streak but it means there is a huge leak in the player's game.
Off course bankrollmanagment is a personal thing, some are comfortable playing with 10 buy ins, others need 100 buy ins to feel they can play their style.
Joined: May '08
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Posted by erru9107: HU SnG's: 100 SnG's: 50 DoN SnG's: 25 MT SnG's: 75 MTT's: 100 Cash: 20
Its quitte good for beginner bankrollmanagement imo. HU sng can be lower i think, something like 60. DoNs setup to 40. MT sng is ok. MTTs ok. Cash better 40 imo.
When you allready have a roll and building it further too a decent big roll management must be set less risky, something like this:
Joined: Jun '10
Location: Belgium
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Posted by erru9107: So, I'm not really sure what type of player I am so I'm usually playing one type of game one session and the next session I play another type of game. That's a good thing but I do have one problem: bankroll management. I usually have a general rule of 20 buy-ins no matter what type of game it is. But I know that's not the best way to aproach it. So I'd like to apply one type of bankroll management for every type of game meaning I'll change for every session. So here's what I figure, let me know what you think!
HU SnG's: 100 SnG's: 50 DoN SnG's: 25 MT SnG's: 75 MTT's: 100 Cash: 20
I think you better raise your number for the cash games/SNG DoN up to 30
I do not understand why you set 100 for HU SNG as yuo have theoretically 50% chance to win. I would lower this number to 30
For MTT you need at least 75,
I personnally play MTT not frequently as they last to long (several hours) so when I do I dare not to follow any rules of bankrollmanagement. But this only happens a few times in a year.
Joined: Nov '09
Location: Canada
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I mostly play cash, so I will only comment on that one. Personally I am okay with 20 BI up to about NL30, but my preference is 50 BI at all levels. I like to play a comfortable, natural game and not be freaking out over a donk call wiping out a BI. When you have many BIs if you get a vicious bad beat it barely leaves a scratch on your bankroll, and you can laugh it off knowing that in the long run you will beat that donk 9 times out of 10 with the hand you had.
Joined: Apr '09
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The list you show seems reasonable, but i think that this should only apply for games above $2 or even $5 minimum buy-in. I had to say this to clarify one point: we all know that people who have $10 on the cashier don't respect any of these rules and always tend to come to forums talking bad about this type of strategy. But there's also many players who opt to deposit only $10 or $20 when they think about playing a little, lets say a saturday night in front of the PC, and they will only stop either when they reach a good amount to withdraw or when they spend it all. I wouldn't call these players the fish, like many should have thought in the begining, because those don't usually play $5 buy-in games. For these players, they don't define a strategy only with the money they put in a poker software, they prefer to deposit only what they know they can spend without suffering for future online poker sessions. The rules you talk about are defined for the player to think about all the money he has available to play and the one he should invest in each game according to the available amount. The guys i told you about can have $500 or $1,000 available per month to play but they opt to deposit only what they can spend in the session instead of depositing it all, that's why they go for $20 or $50 deposits.
Joined: Oct '11
Location: Sweden
Age: 32 (M)
Posts: 1410
I have to thank all of you for your input! This really helps me to put things in a perspective so I eventually can decide how I want to set up my bankroll management!
Fakiry: What you say is very true and I haven't really thought about it in that way before. The thing for me tho is that I can really only play with what I manage to get from freerolls atm (I just have to wait about 1,5 months for my first salary before I can deposit) so I use the cash game bankroll management (20 BI) on the lowest level with the lowest possible BI ($0,20).
Anyway, thanks to all of you for your input! It's greatly appreciated!
Joined: Jan '11
Location: United States
Age: 60 (M)
Posts: 3361
Posted by erru9107: So, I'm not really sure what type of player I am so I'm usually playing one type of game one session and the next session I play another type of game. That's a good thing but I do have one problem: bankroll management. I usually have a general rule of 20 buy-ins no matter what type of game it is. But I know that's not the best way to aproach it. So I'd like to apply one type of bankroll management for every type of game meaning I'll change for every session. So here's what I figure, let me know what you think!
HU SnG's: 100 SnG's: 50 DoN SnG's: 25 MT SnG's: 75 MTT's: 100 Cash: 20
nice post erru, I definitely won't comment on this since I don't know nor understand alot about what it actually defines so if you reply explain that part to me for each type of game. I mena, are you saying to manage your BR you need to play at levels using these figures? Example: Does HU SnG's @ 100 mean managing your BR with $100 in it would allow you to play $5 buyins @ 20 times. Regular SnG's @ $50 = $2.50 BI each x 20 = $50 BR????
Still enjoyed reading everyone's replies / opinions on this topic.
Joined: Oct '11
Location: Sweden
Age: 32 (M)
Posts: 1410
Posted by Greenmohave:
Posted by erru9107: So, I'm not really sure what type of player I am so I'm usually playing one type of game one session and the next session I play another type of game. That's a good thing but I do have one problem: bankroll management. I usually have a general rule of 20 buy-ins no matter what type of game it is. But I know that's not the best way to aproach it. So I'd like to apply one type of bankroll management for every type of game meaning I'll change for every session. So here's what I figure, let me know what you think!
HU SnG's: 100 SnG's: 50 DoN SnG's: 25 MT SnG's: 75 MTT's: 100 Cash: 20
nice post erru, I definitely won't comment on this since I don't know nor understand alot about what it actually defines so if you reply explain that part to me for each type of game. I mena, are you saying to manage your BR you need to play at levels using these figures? Example: Does HU SnG's @ 100 mean managing your BR with $100 in it would allow you to play $5 buyins @ 20 times. Regular SnG's @ $50 = $2.50 BI each x 20 = $50 BR????
Still enjoyed reading everyone's replies / opinions on this topic.
I mean that I would need that number of buy-in's to justify playing at that level. Say $5 BI for HU SnG's, then I would need a bankroll at $500.
thefly131: You asked why I set the number of BI's for HU SnG's at 100 when I basically have 50% chance of winning. The reason is simple: Variance. I'm not all that familiar about HU SnG's but from what I understand, variance is a real b*tch and downswings can be enormous! I'd rather be on the safe side then sit there with a busted bankroll.
Joined: Aug '11
Location: Portugal
Age: 39 (M)
Posts: 232
I think your bankroll management is okish, always pointing to 50/100 BI whatever gametype is fine. 20 is kinda low for any game imo, and DoN is a -EV believe me don't play that crap only if you wanna make a quick buck but long term just check DoN players graphs, funny stuff. It's good to grind points tho. Anyways, your idea about the thing is not bad keep it up.
Joined: Apr '09
Location: Australia
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Posted by fcumred:
Your cash buy ins are way too low. You should have at least 200 buy ins for cash games to cover really bad downswings.
lol what? 200 X 100BB buyins for micro limit cash?? hahahaha you would take 10 years just to reach nl100 !!
I think 20BI is fine for anything under nl100 - once you get a roll of say $2-3K you probably want to do a bit more to protect it, plus the game becomes a lot harder to beat and at that point I think 40-60BI is a bit better.. nits will always tell you 100+ and I think possibly once you're playing with a $10-20K roll then 100BI+ probably isn't a bad idea.
But seriously, if you're just screwing around with a couple hundred bucks, then 20BI is fine - if you happen to hit a really bad downswing you can always deposit again without breaking the bank.. It's only once your roll becomes a bit more serious that 'just depositing again' isn't really a viable bankroll management plan.
------------ FWIW - most good, aggressive cash-player posts I've read on bankroll management state they crushed the lower levels moving up with between 10-20BIs.. The solid-nitty types definitely do it with more like like 100BI (probably not even 200BI then though lol). Seriously though - most of the big names on the nosebleeds smashed through the lower levels with some very "loose" bankroll management. You don't get rich easily without taking risks. It's just a matter of managing how much 'risk' you're willing to take.
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Posted by occultum: and DoN is a -EV believe me don't play that crap only if you wanna make a quick buck but long term just check DoN players graphs, funny stuff. It's good to grind points tho.
haha - Doomdy here is a long-term (*was*) DoN player.. Mind you, they're definitely not -EV if you're beating them.. You can grind a small ROI out on them - plus rakeback/bonuses and do alright. But they're definitely a 'grind' in the true sense of the word.
Edited by jessthehuman (10 October 2012 @ 00:29 GMT)
Joined: Apr '09
Location: Portugal
Age: 44 (M)
Posts: 4827
Posted by erru9107: I have to thank all of you for your input! This really helps me to put things in a perspective so I eventually can decide how I want to set up my bankroll management!
Fakiry: What you say is very true and I haven't really thought about it in that way before. The thing for me tho is that I can really only play with what I manage to get from freerolls atm (I just have to wait about 1,5 months for my first salary before I can deposit) so I use the cash game bankroll management (20 BI) on the lowest level with the lowest possible BI ($0,20).
Anyway, thanks to all of you for your input! It's greatly appreciated!
I am glad you like my comment. Sometimes tend to think only in the theory, and when they realize about the money they have in their account without a possibility of depositing so more at that moment, they feel like if they were playing against strategic rules, which isn’t true. Keep bringing your doubts and comment on other forums, we all like to know what players think about the questions that come to the forum every now and then.
Joined: May '08
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Posted by erru9107: HU SnG's: 100 SnG's: 50 DoN SnG's: 25 MT SnG's: 75 MTT's: 100 Cash: 20
HU SnG's- if you read a bit on the web- they are actually as safe if not safer in the long run as dons, so you can play safely with even 20-25. cash- surely 20 is way too little, i think you forgot one zero at the end...maybe 100 would be a safe enough figure. all others look more or less fine to me
