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  10-Oct-12, 22:35   #1
Why are poker sites limiting the number of tables you can have open? 0 
mahdrof 

Joined: Nov '09
Location: Canada
Age: 47 (M)
Posts: 2367
A few years ago in the glory days of online poker, it wasn't uncommon to be severely limited in terms of the number of tables you could have open on one site at a time. As the softwares kept getting better it was almost like a cold war arms race, with different sites trying to gain the edge on each other with the number of tables you could have open at the same time, and multitabling became part of the poker jargon.

I usually stick to about six tables, but sometimes go up to twelve depending on how I feel. Recently on 888 I was trying to open up a couple more tables when a message popped up telling me I had maxxed out. I thought maybe I needed to re-install the software, but when I researched it further it seems other sites are doing the same thing. Apparently it has something to do with trying to keep the fish in the game, but I am not sure I follow the logic. The more tables the more action the more rake, no?

Any thoughts or comments would be appreciated.

     
  10-Oct-12, 23:56   #2
  0 
jessthehuman 

Joined: Apr '09
Location: Australia
Age: 32 (M)
Posts: 6441
I think it's an anti-bot measure (my best guess). Some sites have restrictions that you can apply to have lifted, once you've deposited/passed security, etc.

     
  11-Oct-12, 00:06   #3
  0 
awood88 
Joined: Feb '08
Location: United Kingdom
Age: 28 (M)
Posts: 1881
First of all I don't think I would ever multi-table that many tables. Couldn't do it and keep concentration. I doubt there's much call for 15+ tables and 14 tables is a reasonable limit if they have a genuine reason. If you can play that many and make a profit then good for you, especially if you have a good rake-back deal.

I don't think it would have anything to do with keeping fish on the site. For one thing those who multitable that much would mostly be regulars and experienced. It takes a lot of practice to manage several tables even if you are just calling or shoving with anything.

Also like you say more tables means more rake and if people bust their bankroll quicker it isn't an issue cos they play the same number of hands. However, when grinders multi-table they probably get involved in less hands and if the majority of cash players are doing this that means you are less likely to see a flop and that means less rake per hand. So I would imagine poker sites realize that as the number of multitabling increases the number of hands played goes up and the rake per hand goes down, which eventually becomes negative for the site.

Alternatively it could have something to with places on tables. Imagine you have 20 active full ring tables at that level on the site. If 6 players are sat at every single table that makes it very difficult for newly logged-in players to bag a spare seat. There may be plenty of players waiting but no one wants to sit down at an empty table and it takes a long time for a new player to build up to just multitabling 4 tables.

If there was no cap I think you'd always get one person opening up infinite tables just to see if it can be done and the site doesn't want that. With so many players online you will get the odd person just going crazy on every table and that probably makes it difficult for the site to keep track of the player and could even f**k up their system. Some players will do it just to complete a bonus. So I think there should be some cap and 14 tables is probably enough.

     
  11-Oct-12, 01:12   #4
  0 
retribution 

Joined: Mar '11
Location: Canada
Age: 37 (M)
Posts: 1490
Posted by awood88:
However, when grinders multi-table they probably get involved in less hands and if the majority of cash players are doing this that means you are less likely to see a flop and that means less rake per hand. So I would imagine poker sites realize that as the number of multitabling increases the number of hands played goes up and the rake per hand goes down, which eventually becomes negative for the site.


You'd think this would be the case, however if a hand sees a flop, it can take around 1min to finish, meaning on average a table could see 60 hands per hour if every hand sees a flop. However, if no flop is dealt, a hand could be over in like 15-20 seconds which means you can get 3x as many non-flop hands in the same time you would flopped hands. So sure, a table may be tighter, but it will also around the same number of flopped hands in the long run.

The only down side is if the table was FULL of regs with a VPIP around 10-15% and no loose/maniac players. This would decrease the average pot, and thus the rake WOULD drop in that scenario. However, the chances of any one table being full of 9 regs that tight just wouldn't happen. Anyone who's multi-tabling a lot of tables likely will be table selecting and would avoid tables that tight like the plague because it'd be -ev to play there.

I'm pretty sure that yeah, the table limit is an anti-bot measure. Most sites DO impose a limit, however if you write support an e-mail, they will often increase the limit on a case by case basis.

On another note, 12 tables is nothing. I've seen YT videos of people playing 50 freaking tables. IIRC, Isildur did a challenge a while back where he played like 20+ tables for like 24 hours or something. Can't remember all the details, just that he had 3 huge ass monitors and a s**t pile of tables open lol.

     
  11-Oct-12, 06:01   #5
  0 
shokaku 

Joined: May '08
Location: Germany
Age: 51 (M)
Posts: 6235
I guess this was done to protect the recreational players from the multitabling grinders. No fun waiting for the grinder to solve the problems on his other tables, and finaly playing attention to your table.

     
  11-Oct-12, 07:16   #6
  0 
ayaraled 
Joined: Apr '11
Location: Philippines
Age: 39 (M)
Posts: 544
i can do only 6 maybe or maybe 8 or 10 but about 15 tables is way too much for me....maybe its on the account problem...maybe tracking an account is more harder if you do multitabling over 15 or software problem may occur....

     
  11-Oct-12, 08:48   #7
  0 
mahdrof 

Joined: Nov '09
Location: Canada
Age: 47 (M)
Posts: 2367
Posted by shokaku:
I guess this was done to protect the recreational players from the multitabling grinders. No fun waiting for the grinder to solve the problems on his other tables, and finaly playing attention to your table.

This is one of the reasons I have heard for this restriction on the number of tables open. Apparently 888 slimmed down to 8 tables last fall, now they are down to 6 and I have heard rumours they are considering 4. My favourite number for the past year has been 6 full ring, but sometimes the lapses between action hands feels long - if they go to 4 I will have to multitable between sites.

     
  11-Oct-12, 18:55   #8
  0 
Macubaas 
Joined: Apr '11
Location: Romania
Age: 27 (M)
Posts: 6668
I think there are more reasons, not a single one...

First of all i know this is definately an anti-bot reglementation that i first ead on ipoker if i'm right. Secondly is what you discussed above, if players could open so many tables it would take minutes and that would make the tables for people that only play at couple of tables pretty boring.

I think the most tables open you can have on stars, i think it's 24 Blink

     
  11-Oct-12, 19:29   #9
  0 
Greenmohave 

Joined: Jan '11
Location: United States
Age: 52 (M)
Posts: 3361
I guess I don't have any comments that justify the sites for setting multi-table limits, but find it hard to manage 3 to 4 games at a time. I think playing more is capable, but I guess I try to focus on player reads and what cards have recently played, but that's just how I play.
Do you actually fare well playing 6 tables? And wow! To play 12 tables at once would be entirely impossible for me to manage.
One thing I am curious about is, can you run more then one site at a time without having PC issues?
I think I'll post a thread on this.

     
  11-Oct-12, 23:00   #10
  0 
jessthehuman 

Joined: Apr '09
Location: Australia
Age: 32 (M)
Posts: 6441
Posted by Greenmohave:

Do you actually fare well playing 6 tables?



6 tables for me I can still play with a pretty good amount of focus. It takes practice - but mostly the trick is to learn to RELAX! I remember first playing 4+ tables and feeling overwhelmed and ultimately started acting based on anxiety and panic. But once you learn to chill-out and take it all in, you can ride with the pace and 6 tables actually feels pretty slow.

For me once I go up to 8+ tables, I start to play worse - I don't really fare well 9-tabling cash if I try and make any fancy plays or anything. I find with 8+ tables I am best of playing formula based formats like SNG and MTT where I pretty well know now exactly what my ranges and options are in each spot.

     
  11-Oct-12, 23:08   #11
  0 
takingdrugs 

Joined: Nov '11
Location: United Kingdom
Age: 33 (M)
Posts: 744
i struggle with 2 tables lol

     
  11-Oct-12, 23:16   #12
  0 
aburila 
Joined: Mar '11
Location: United Kingdom
Age: 31 (M)
Posts: 108
now i could play about 6-8 cash tables in the same time ... but in the days when i play only MTT's and SnG's usually i have at least 12-16 tables open in the same time...
the only 2 sites where i haven't seen a limit of tables yet is PP and PS

     
  12-Oct-12, 13:31   #13
  0 
xdomagojx 

Joined: Sep '10
Location: Croatia
Age: 28 (M)
Posts: 399
My best guess is also to prevent bots from taking advantage of it.
May also be to prevent "tight" action that goes on when playing on so many tables. That's bad specially for sites with no so many players online at the same time. It may not be a problem for site like pokerstars but many others lose players faster or do not generate enough rake in such situations.
Less tables generate more action and lose plays. TBH that's one of the reasons i prefer smaller sites, cause you get close to live action on their tables apart from pokerstars which is totally different ball game from my experience. Always such tight plays you just can't play single table anymore.

     
  12-Oct-12, 15:03   #14
  0 
Sorin888 
Joined: Apr '11
Location: Romania
Age: 51 (M)
Posts: 2375
In my opinion is a technical problem because of increasing the amount of information need to be transfered from server to your pc and their server can not give the amount of bad beats per user in more than 8 tables

     
  12-Oct-12, 17:20   #15
  0 
mahdrof 

Joined: Nov '09
Location: Canada
Age: 47 (M)
Posts: 2367
email exchange with 888 support:

Hi,

How come I can only open six tables at a time when I play poker on 888? Is this a technical problem? Do I need to re-install the software?

Thank you for your help.

Regards,

mahdrof

***********************************************

Dear mahdrof,

Thank you for contacting us, my name is Luis and I will assist you today.

In order to maintain a smooth flow and ensure the maximum enjoyment for our members, we have taken the decision to limit the number of simultaneous table types any member can have open to 6. This means that you can play up to 6 cash tables and 6 tournaments concurrently.

Although we appreciate that some prefer to play at a greater number of tables, overall and after listening to member feedback - we strongly believe that this decision will benefit the majority of our players.

We apologise for any inconvenience this may have caused and hope that you continue to enjoy playing at 888poker .

Mahdrof if you require any further assistance with this or any other matter, please feel free to contact us.

Kind regards,
Luis P.
Member Support Representative

     
  12-Oct-12, 18:53   #16
  0 
Macubaas 
Joined: Apr '11
Location: Romania
Age: 27 (M)
Posts: 6668
So here you have the official answer from 888 and frankly i think their limit is a bit too low...

I mean 12 tables should be more than enough for cash games but on tournaments where the game is much slower the limit could have been a bit bigger.

     
  12-Oct-12, 20:45   #17
  0 
Mober 
Joined: Mar '09
Location: Greece
Age: 39 (F)
Posts: 10045
First time i see this restriction, and kinda hard to notice it, if you dont multitable
at that high.
Used to play more than six tables at once for a short time of period, but i was losing
the ball most of the times. Smile
Now if i multitable, its mostly four tables at once and sometimes up to six.

     
  13-Oct-12, 10:14   #18
  0 
damosk 
Joined: Feb '11
Location: United Kingdom
Age: 52 (M)
Posts: 4873
I kind of agree with Green.....multitabling on more than 4 tables is pretty insane.... so personally wont be affected by a limit of 12 or 24. As well as bots there is probably something to do with the data transfer as well . Dunno really. Not very helpful post....but it is early!!

     
  14-Oct-12, 19:50   #19
  0 
Predator1447 
Joined: Oct '12
Location: Belarus
Age: 30 (M)
Posts: 42
I agree with a Mahdrof.Today on the Poker888 is a limit of opening tables.Now this number is 6 only.Its not very good for regulars,which play on the 8plus tables.And good for fishes,who do not play more than 2 tables.the conclusion is simple.Regulars cant to win fishes,which goes to do deposits)))))

     
  15-Oct-12, 14:42   #20
  0 
mahdrof 

Joined: Nov '09
Location: Canada
Age: 47 (M)
Posts: 2367
Posted by damosk:
I kind of agree with Green.....multitabling on more than 4 tables is pretty insane.... so personally wont be affected by a limit of 12 or 24. As well as bots there is probably something to do with the data transfer as well . Dunno really. Not very helpful post....but it is early!!

It took me a while to build up my number of tables, but quite honestly six full ring tables tiled on my 600 mm computer screen is not hard to manage, and even there are lapses between action hands which can sometimes feel long. Playing more tables keeps you sharper, allows you to be choosier and not get bored and start playing any two cards. After you have played enough hands the decisions you make start to become automatic, even in post-flop play.

My intention with this thread was not to discuss mutlitabling specifically, but hear other people's viewpoints on poker sites restricting the number of tables you can play. As I mentioned at the start of the thread, limiting the number of tables you can play goes against what the sites were doing only a couple of years ago, and I was wondering how many people were affected. Regardless however, I welcome all comments and don't mind discussing multitabling with any BRM members in this thread.

     
  16-Oct-12, 11:41   #21
  0 
Mober 
Joined: Mar '09
Location: Greece
Age: 39 (F)
Posts: 10045
The screen size makes a huge difference when it comes to multitabling.
With a 14" screen you cant do much, and when you tile the tables, you can hardly tell
the difference between same colors unless you have your eyes glued on the screen Smile
So you get tired pretty easy after a couple of minutes.

     
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