Joined: Mar '11
Location: Canada
Age: 44 (M)
Posts: 1490
So finally got an email from FT about their plans for RB, ironman etc on relaunch. Looks like they will be doing away with the existing programs, and replacing it. Here's what they said:
On that day, a comprehensive player rewards program will be introduced, which will replace the Iron Man Challenge, Black Card and Cash Back Bonus programs.
The way in which players are rewarded will be greatly simplified, with eligible players receiving weekly cash payments. These payments will be based on the number of FT Points accumulated, at a rate of up to $2.50 for every 100 FT Points earned.
My take is that it won't be as good as existing RB deals. I had a feeling that they'd screw with things and shaft the players, but I had no idea it would be before the site even relaunched. I REALLY am pissed off, and I'm sure other FT players will share my anger. I think it's a poor move on their part. They should have at least waited until they had re-established things before changing it like they have.
Joined: Apr '09
Location: Australia
Age: 40 (M)
Posts: 6483
Like stars basically; it will be good if you're a heavy grinder.. I imagine anyone raking $2K+/month will reap benefits better than the old flat 27%, but for casual players, I think the old deal would be better.
Edited by jessthehuman (13 October 2012 @ 06:53 GMT)
Joined: Mar '11
Location: Canada
Age: 44 (M)
Posts: 1490
Posted by jessthehuman: Like stars basically; it will be good if you're a heavy grinder.. I imagine anyone raking $2K+/month will reap benefits better than the old flat 27%, but for casual players, I think the old deal would be better.
Well IIRC, you got 7 FT points / 1$ in fees you paid. So basically their $2.50 / 100 points "cash bonus" works out to be around .025 cents / point. On their old platform, you got 1 FT point per .1425 cents in rake you paid. So basically each point was worth .1425 cents * 27% = .038 cents. Not hard to see the HUGE difference it makes, not just casual players but big time grinders as well. I mean this basically cuts "RB" by 40% meaning instead of 27%, they are getting more like 18-19%.
For break-even grinders playing for RB, this will be a HUGE chunk of their profit. A player clearing 3k a month would be losing around $270 a month in profits based on 9% loss in RB. For a lot of people, this could mean the difference between barely break-even players and losing players. It seems like such an insignificant number, but consider the vast majority of players are already losing players, with another huge chunk being barely break-even, it will have a huge effect on the bottom end. Sure it will mean more money flowing into the site in terms of deposit, but it may discourage losing players from re-depositing, as they will go broke that much faster.
The reason FT was so great had a lot to do with the software, but just as much because the player pool was so soft. The last thing I think anyone wants to see, is to see FT become a reg-fest like PS is.
In contrast to how things were on FT, I can honestly say the games are harder on PS. It might have to do with the loss of US players, as well as a lot of other countries, but I'm confident that it will have an impact on the games. This is why smaller sites are so soft, because they offer much better deals to players, which keeps bad players playing longer.
That's JUST considering the RB. If you factor in Iron man medals and black card (which really only affects the heavy grinders TBH) it starts to really add up which will hurt the heavy grinders (which IMHO any good site should be kissing the asses of).
On an entirely different note, not all players got RB , which means across the board this may actually benefit some people, as they will now actually get a better deal than they were before.
All I can say is, they BETTER honor existing Iron man balances until they are spent. If they just outright cancel them, they are going to have a LOT of very angry players.
Edited by retribution (13 October 2012 @ 07:25 GMT)
Joined: May '08
Location: Lithuania
Age: 39 (M)
Posts: 10090
well i doubt you could've expected anything else from pokerstars- they have a working rb structure with stars and they have no reasons to offer players anything more than they do here, so naturally if tilt was offering more- this had to be fixed, you just have to accept this or forget about full tilt- as the saying goes- nothing personal, it's just business
The reason FT was so great had a lot to do with the software, but just as much because the player pool was so soft. The last thing I think anyone wants to see, is to see FT become a reg-fest like PS is.
In contrast to how things were on FT, I can honestly say the games are harder on PS...
I agree with this. I expressed my hopes in other thread that they won't change a thing with relaunch cause all of it made FT so popular. Let's hope they won't change software :/ If they do they can change name as well cause it won't have anything in common with old FT.
Joined: Feb '11
Location: United Kingdom
Age: 59 (M)
Posts: 5712
Its always going to be somewhat of a refelction of Pokerstars....but lets hope they retain some of the refinements that FTP had that pulled so many lovely players there that made it welcoming and intersting place to win. Hang the rakeback...just win!
Joined: May '11
Location: United Kingdom
Age: 58 (M)
Posts: 1372
IMHO there's is absolutely no point in harking back to what used to be offered on FT. What they offered there in the past is irrelevant as ultimately they couldn't deliver. It would be naive to expect Stars to continue with, what was, a failed business model.
Joined: Mar '11
Location: United Kingdom
Age: 38 (M)
Posts: 108
i knew that they'll change the RB system ... but let's hope that they won't change also the format of the games also ... because if they'll make it like the PS then i think that they'll lose a lot of players...and the only ones that will really benefit of the new RB system will be like on PS the the high rollers ... a micro or low stake player will play just for the fun and to try to build a nice bankroll....the medium stake players will also benefit from in but i don't think will make a huge difference in they're bankroll.... and i really hope they won't change the MTT and SnG structure ... especially the late reg times ... which on PS is absurd at the moment ... 3 h ....
Joined: Apr '11
Location: Romania
Age: 58 (M)
Posts: 2432
Dear mobsters. Fulltilt is gone, why are people crying over something that was... Fulltilt is owned by Pokerstars obviously this was the inevitability of that deal. All the awesome promotions FullTilt used to have(2010 and 2011) weren't actually sustainable in terms of funds, everyone knows they didn't exactly make sure the player funds were managed...
Joined: Apr '11
Location: Romania
Age: 35 (M)
Posts: 6669
One of the major fears among players was that pokerstars will try to introduce a similar system to pokerstars VIP system on FTP too...
I persoanlly loved the fact that on FTP you got rakeback at the end of the week no matter how many points you made. We'll see once they open what the changes will be.
Joined: Oct '09
Location: United Kingdom
Age: 57 (M)
Posts: 667
Hi Retribution. To be honest I cannot remember how much rake back I got, but has been said you cannot expect PS to maintain FTP's offers - not feasible. I just want my £100.00 (roughly) back and then I can aim high at a tournament on there before PS realises that the competition is easier and start playing with the cards...........................
GL to you all...............................................
Joined: Mar '09
Location: Greece
Age: 47 (F)
Posts: 14136
No doubt they were to make changes in their benefit. They have invested some major money in that and they expect to get it as soon as possible. Also i dont think they care if they lose small stake players at all.
Joined: Mar '08
Location: United Kingdom
Age: 44 (M)
Posts: 6714
If they want to restructure it to match the most popular platform around, then I say go ahead, I don't get RB there anyway, so little difference to me, just will be happy to hit the cashier button and take it to the real felt.
Joined: Jan '11
Location: United States
Age: 60 (M)
Posts: 3361
This ia all good information to know about and I never played at PS except a few times when I just started playing electronice poker. Soon as I discovered FT I was sold and a lot of it had to do with the software and game variation. Overall I liked their structure.
I know it will be quite some time if ever, before U.S. citizens will be allowed to even play but I do hope it's still the same from a software and game structure standpoint.
As for the RB I don't play enough for it to be of any concern, but I hope it works out for the players it does effect.
Joined: Apr '11
Location: Romania
Age: 35 (M)
Posts: 6669
Green, the good part for all US players is that will e able to cashout their money and also try some play money games just as a reminder of the old times...
As for the RB deal SNG or MTT players won't be affected but people that used to play rush exclusive RB many times meant the difference between minus and profit at the end of a week.
Joined: Mar '09
Location: Greece
Age: 47 (F)
Posts: 14136
Cant say im concerned about the rake back deal since i didnt get any, in the first place I wonder if they are going to offer RB to players who already have an account, and didnt get any. That would be an incentive for many players to keep their money in and keep playing
Joined: Mar '11
Location: Germany
Age: 55 (M)
Posts: 1242
Well I was afraid of this. Sounds to me that they will run it like Pokerstars2 and thats what I don´t like. Would have loved to see that they run it different from Pokerstars with RB deal and other nice promotions.
