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  10-May-13, 20:02   #1
SnG Bubble Strategy 0 
erru9107 
Joined: Oct '11
Location: Sweden
Age: 25 (M)
Posts: 910
I've been playing a lot of the 6 handed SnGs lately. My biggest problem seems to be the bubble. I've calculated that from the ones I didn't finish ITM, 68% I finished 3rd. This shows that my biggest leak is obviously the bubble play.

So, does anyone of the SnG sharks here at the forum have any tips on how to approach this in order to finish ITM more often?

     
  10-May-13, 20:55   #2
  0 
alakazoo 
Joined: Apr '13
Location: Canada
Age: 29 (M)
Posts: 333
you got to tighten up your game as much as possible when your on the bubble Smile Even if the player raising have shown a lot of donkey hands, you got to be really strong before you push. And play your position as much as you can Smile

3rd out of 6 isn't in the money? I like to play double or nothing 6 handed sng

     
  10-May-13, 22:12   #3
  0 
Greenmohave 

Joined: Jan '11
Location: United States
Age: 52 (M)
Posts: 3361
My strategy in SnG's lean more towards the 9 player games and they usually pay top three (3) positions. I'm usually not playing many hands before the blinds get to be 50/100 or even 75/150. By doing this alone it seems 3 players fall out by the time the blinds reach this point.

I actually learned to hold my own playing SnG's from a thread that was posted in this forum about a year to a year an a half ago. The post is by Islandjack who I haven't seen in the forum for nearly 6 months. Try searching back through all these posts and it's worth the read.

     
  11-May-13, 02:25   #4
  0 
Plexo 
Joined: Aug '09
Location: Chile
Age: 30 (M)
Posts: 1336
I would recommend you that play agressive, specially if blinds are high at that time.

However, play agressive in the bubble means to open your range only tu push all-in, but you must be very tight to call any all in (I would say JJ, QQ, KK, AA). I would even fold AK if I have enough chips to have good fold equity to push in the next hand. This because you dont want to play a flip in the bubble, since in the long run is a very EV negative move.

So, in summary my advice would be to open your range tu push and being very tight to call all ins.

good luck!

     
  11-May-13, 07:50   #5
  0 
erru9107 
Joined: Oct '11
Location: Sweden
Age: 25 (M)
Posts: 910
Hmm... alakazo says play tight, Plexo says play agressive. Not sure who to trust here Tongue

Green: I've been trying to find that thread before without success. I'll have a go at it again.

     
  11-May-13, 09:56   #6
  0 
djpremier 
Joined: Dec '10
Location: Finland
Age: 24 (M)
Posts: 419
Try some ICM guides from some strategy sites Smile

     
  11-May-13, 11:34   #7
  0 
pochui 

Joined: May '08
Location: Lithuania
Age: 32 (M)
Posts: 8643
hey erru, you have to collect the stats- u say that you calculated that 68% of the times you finished 3rd. you identified that the problem lies here- now you need to collect the data & see why are you losing. it's always best to learn from your own mistakes. i think there is no "correct" strategy (unless you buy my "Win 109.5% of your tourneys you play" guide for $99). sure you can read lots of strategies, tips- but i the end i think it's more trial & error...collect the data, analyze it, find the leaks & off to make some cash. gl Thumbs Up

     
  11-May-13, 13:14   #8
  0 
zeroster 

Joined: May '11
Location: United Kingdom
Age: 51 (M)
Posts: 1372
Posted by Greenmohave:

I actually learned to hold my own playing SnG's from a thread that was posted in this forum about a year to a year an a half ago. The post is by Islandjack who I haven't seen in the forum for nearly 6 months. Try searching back through all these posts and it's worth the read.


Is this the one Green?

http://www.bankrollmob.com/forum.asp?mode=thread&id...

     
  11-May-13, 16:17   #9
  0 
Greenmohave 

Joined: Jan '11
Location: United States
Age: 52 (M)
Posts: 3361
Posted by zeroster:
Posted by Greenmohave:

I actually learned to hold my own playing SnG's from a thread that was posted in this forum about a year to a year an a half ago. The post is by Islandjack who I haven't seen in the forum for nearly 6 months. Try searching back through all these posts and it's worth the read.


Is this the one Green?

http://www.bankrollmob.com/forum.asp?mode=thread&id...



That's it Zeroster and now that you located it I'm going to print it out. Every time I start to go on the down in SnG's I think of this post by Island and I always try to remember in detail. I'm not kidding anyone, if you abide to this you will improve your game. At least from an SnG standpoint, I actually improved overall by a lot of these tips.

Thanks for locating! I searched my rear off trying to find this!

     
  12-May-13, 12:35   #10
  0 
mirexxx 
Joined: Sep '11
Location: Bosnia and Herzegovina
Age: 33 (M)
Posts: 2731

Why might you want to keep the bubble of a sit n go going? Usually your objective is to get into the money and then go for the first place! Well getting to first place can be greatly assisted by keeping all of your opponents stacks as small as possible… sometimes a tiny stack at the bubble can give you the opportunity to take chips from your medium stacked opponents. The idea is that they do not want to go out in 4th while there is still a tiny stack at the table – you use this fact to your advantage..

     
  12-May-13, 12:46   #11
  0 
yout85 
Joined: May '12
Location: United Kingdom
Age: 31 (M)
Posts: 2016
Hi erru... I'd have to come down on the side of playing aggressive on the bubble, because of the "gap principle" - ie, you need a better hand to CALL all in than you do to PUSH all in. So if you are pushing all in more often, the range of hands you will get called by goes down.

In a 6-max, 35% of the prize goes to 2nd and 65% to 1st. So gathering chips on the bubble when people naturally tighten up and going into heads up with a chip lead is always the best play.

There's a nifty little program I like to use called Tournament Shark. It can not run while playing, but once your tournaments are finished, you import your hand histories into it and it highlights every hand where it considers you "should" push. It will show you times when you did push, but shouldn't have and times when you folded or called when you should have pushed. Studying the info given on there will soon give you a good idea of how to play on the bubble...

I strongly recommend you check it out.

     
  12-May-13, 12:59   #12
  0 
Greenmohave 

Joined: Jan '11
Location: United States
Age: 52 (M)
Posts: 3361
Posted by yout85:
Hi erru... I'd have to come down on the side of playing aggressive on the bubble, because of the "gap principle" - ie, you need a better hand to CALL all in than you do to PUSH all in. So if you are pushing all in more often, the range of hands you will get called by goes down.

In a 6-max, 35% of the prize goes to 2nd and 65% to 1st. So gathering chips on the bubble when people naturally tighten up and going into heads up with a chip lead is always the best play.

There's a nifty little program I like to use called Tournament Shark. It can not run while playing, but once your tournaments are finished, you import your hand histories into it and it highlights every hand where it considers you "should" push. It will show you times when you did push, but shouldn't have and times when you folded or called when you should have pushed. Studying the info given on there will soon give you a good idea of how to play on the bubble...

I strongly recommend you check it out.



Not to bash this Tournament Shark, but in seeing and reading a post which was recently about this "Tournament Shark" it actually stated data as to how inaccurate this is. I'm not saying one way or another since I personally haven't used it, but if my memory serves me right it was less then 50% accurate in the hand analysis.

     
  12-May-13, 13:26   #13
  0 
yout85 
Joined: May '12
Location: United Kingdom
Age: 31 (M)
Posts: 2016
I don't know about that Green.... but you could very well be right.

Even if that is the case, the lessons you should learn from it about pushing ranges are still there. I'll summarise...


If your "M" is below 10, you should never limp, call a raise, or make a normal raise yourself. It should be strictly all in or fold. Your "M" is simply the amount of chips in the pot before any actions - ie, SB + BB + any antes. Also, if the only people left to act after you all have an M below 10, you should put them all in instead of making a standard raise.

When your M is below 10, I'd recommend pushing any pocket pair, AK, AQ, AJ, AT, KQ and KJs... Once your M drops below 7.5 you'll want to start pushing any Ace or suited kings...
Once your M drops below 5, you should be looking to get your chips in whenever action is on you first. You want to be pushing all in, not calling someone else's push - you need strong cards to call, but not to push.
Once your M drops any lower (you should hope this never happens) any two cards will do. Look for a spot where you're likely to be heads up, so if a big stack raises - call them.

I hope this helps.

Edited by yout85 (Sunday, May 12, 2013 @ 13:35 GMT)


     
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