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  15-May-13, 13:52   #1
Final table, MTT, dwindling stack, what would you do in this spot? 0 
mahdrof 

Joined: Nov '09
Location: Canada
Age: 47 (M)
Posts: 2367
Here is the situation: $700 guaranteed turbo deep stack MTT, $10 BI, out of 85 players we're down to the final six (top ten make the money). Blinds are 3000/6000 with 600 ante, sitting on the button, been card dead for a long time and my stack is dwindlling. Get dealt J9o, everybody folds, sb has 51000 stack and bb 120,000 stack, what do you do and why?

Attached ImagesFinal table question.png

     
  15-May-13, 14:25   #2
  0 
TheIrish77 
Joined: Feb '13
Location: Canada
Age: 38 (M)
Posts: 538
Fold it dude! You'll see something better than that I'm sure before blinds come back around to you. The bigger stacks are more inclined to call with something weaker. Patience is a virtue.


     
  15-May-13, 14:44   #3
  0 
uno1Bomber 

Joined: May '13
Location: Russian Federation
Age: 28 (M)
Posts: 541
all in
hit or miss Big Smile

     
  15-May-13, 14:48   #4
  0 
sadamman 

Joined: Jan '12
Location: United Kingdom
Age: 28 (M)
Posts: 1204
Posted by TheIrish77:
Fold it dude! You'll see something better than that I'm sure before blinds come back around to you. The bigger stacks are more inclined to call with something weaker. Patience is a virtue.



Shock You want them to call with something weaker. Duh. However you have enough chips to survive 1-2 more rounds of waiting for something better. I would fold, and next time you're on the button if its folded to you again, shove on anything.

     
  15-May-13, 15:11   #5
  0 
djpremier 
Joined: Dec '10
Location: Finland
Age: 24 (M)
Posts: 419
I would probably shove at least if it was J9s ... but it's just a gut feeling im not sure if it's the correct move or not ...

Im just thinking there's more than one third of you stack in the middle and SB would be seriously crippled if he called and lost .. so I'm only worried about BB.. if BB calls with any ace, any pair and any broadway (27,6%) J9o is about 36% to win .. and +70% the BB will fold ..so I think its a good push ..

not sure though ... someone with more knowledge please tell us what you think Tongue Tongue

EDIT: actually Im not quite sure about that BBs calling range since your stack is soooo small.. but after 1 orbit you will have next to 0 fold equity .. so I still think you should push

     
  15-May-13, 15:40   #6
  0 
uno1Bomber 

Joined: May '13
Location: Russian Federation
Age: 28 (M)
Posts: 541
Also you can wait for AA AK etc. but that's not mean you'll 100% win
They can call you whith 99 and hit you whith set.
IMHO If you have any chance then try Blink
You said:" ..we're down to the final six (top ten make the money)" So you can't lose Blink
You can win more or less

     
  15-May-13, 17:02   #7
  0 
devagrant 

Joined: May '13
Location: Ireland
Age: 42 (M)
Posts: 54
sorta situation where if it goes against you, there is no 'right' move..... its what makes poker great !!
J9 in that situ, I look at the pot size, my stack size... if I shove ,I am happy to take the blinds n antes so you have to know how likely the Blinds are to call with a hand like QT for eg where you are such a narrow underdog that the numbers look good, considering the Blinds would also insta call with any pp< 99 you are still in a coin-flip situation. its a tough one but by % its a must shove if want to push on for the win but knowing that any call is prob going to have you in a catch-up race...

gotta make reference to djpremiers note on ''gut feeling'' I truly believe this cannot be underestimated when in exactley this type of situation.......

     
  15-May-13, 17:25   #8
  0 
mahdrof 

Joined: Nov '09
Location: Canada
Age: 47 (M)
Posts: 2367
Posted by uno1Bomber:
Also you can wait for AA AK etc. but that's not mean you'll 100% win
They can call you whith 99 and hit you whith set.
IMHO If you have any chance then try Blink
You said:" ..we're down to the final six (top ten make the money)" So you can't lose Blink
You can win more or less

I did shove on this hand, and that was my thinking as well. I am down to the final six, the sixth spot is okay but top two are three and four times as much $. I am hoping they will fold with trash, I will take the blinds and survive another couple of rounds until I hit something better and hopefully double up to take one of the top spots.

Some good responses so far, keep 'em coming and I will post the outcome tomorrow. Thumbs Up

     
  15-May-13, 17:54   #9
  0 
bullettooth1 

Joined: Mar '11
Location: United Kingdom
Age: 32 (M)
Posts: 1635
I would shove. Even tho you only have 5 bb's you still have some decent fold equity as the other stacks aren't so big in comparison. So they can't go calling with a wide range. And what if you fold and next round your stack is shorter and your forced to shove with worse? You are more likely to get called because of your shorter stack.
So it's a shove everytime for me. Hope you won it Big Smile Thumbs Up

     
  15-May-13, 18:30   #10
  0 
pochui 

Joined: May '08
Location: Lithuania
Age: 32 (M)
Posts: 8623
i think this is pure instincts...whatever you do fold/shove even just call you can win doing that & vice versa. one thing to consider- even though you're amongst small stack dudes- still you're not alone in this terrific company, there are 3 small stacks in total...things are not so desperate yet.

i personally would fold hoping other shortstacks get kicked out before me...

     
  15-May-13, 18:40   #11
  0 
teddybears73 
Joined: Nov '11
Location: United Kingdom
Age: 59 (M)
Posts: 3170
i'd take my chances there and shove them, if you wait another rotation and you get worse cards what do you do then ? the shorter your stack the more likely you will get called so shove them now.

     
  16-May-13, 12:10   #12
  0 
mahdrof 

Joined: Nov '09
Location: Canada
Age: 47 (M)
Posts: 2367
Like I said previously, I shoved on this hand and obviously if everybody had folded I would not have posted it for discussion. I wanted to shove while I still had some fold equity, grab the blinds and survive another round or two until I hit something more solid. The small blind called with AQo, but a J fell on the flop, so for an instant I was very happy to think that I would double up and have a shot at making the top two and decent ROI. River was ace. Sad All in all it was nice to run well in a tourney. Seeing Jovica's impressive results in MTT play has encouraged me to start playing them again after several years of not having the time.

Thank you to all who participated in this thread.

     
  16-May-13, 14:30   #13
  0 
jovicakralj 

Joined: Nov '10
Location: Serbia
Age: 29 (M)
Posts: 2075
It is kind of hard decission. I thing whatever you do there you wont make a big mistake. Shove is fine, there is 30% of your stack in middle and you have odds to shove there super wide. Only trouble there is that BB have 120k and he can call you really light. If he have 40-60k that would be perfect. Also at final table payment jumps play big role in decission making. If one or 2 places more doesnt meen you lot at this point then I say is shove. Another important thing is how bb plays. If hes playing loose and calling a lot then you probably should fold and try to find spot with ace or K at least in your hand and then shove and hope you will get called with worse. In other hand if you noticed that he plays tighter and that he is nottype that will call very wide there then its shove. Guy on small blind wont do a thing without really strong hand so he should be out of picture...
I see now that sb called you and thats kind of cooler. You did not do anything wrong. Turbo turneys are like that. Youre forced to make lot of marginal decissions and you have to run like Husein Bolt to make 1st Blink Nice to hear that you decided to play MTT's. For thinking player they have huge value. And Im glad I have made influence on somebody. Im really nothing special in big picture of poker world but Im going in right direction I believe Cool

Edited by jovicakralj (Thursday, May 16, 2013 @ 14:37 GMT)


     
  16-May-13, 15:02   #14
  0 
mahdrof 

Joined: Nov '09
Location: Canada
Age: 47 (M)
Posts: 2367
Posted by jovicakralj:
Im really nothing special in big picture of poker world but Im going in right direction I believe Cool


In life humility is a great thing to have IMO, keeps you grounded instead of thinking you are better than you actually are. You are young, have consistently proven your poker skills and have your whole life ahead of you, at this point the limits you reach will be the ones you choose.

     
  16-May-13, 18:57   #15
  0 
earl732 
Joined: Apr '13
Location: Georgia
Age: 29 (M)
Posts: 1
i think fold if u are aggressive player, if u are passive player raise 3 bet

     
  16-May-13, 19:03   #16
  0 
alakazoo 
Joined: Apr '13
Location: Canada
Age: 29 (M)
Posts: 333
as hard as it can be when your not getting any good play dealt for a long time, I think you should still fold it here and hope for a monster hand to be comming soon. Every place prizes get more and more interesting as it goes so 1 place can be a good difference, worth to be patient

     
  16-May-13, 19:49   #17
  0 
demodawggy 

Joined: Feb '12
Location: Canada
Age: 56 (M)
Posts: 5680
One shove and you could be dead.... I'd opt to string it out a bit and hope for something better...

Any face pair or face connectors and I'd shove with that....

It's like the Leprechaun said..... ya gotta have patience...

Although at this point in the game, being card dead so long,...it appears you've had PLENTY of patience...

Just from my experience,....I know things don't stay dead forever... Smile

     
  15-Sep-13, 10:10   #18
  0 
loddar_m 
Joined: Feb '08
Location: Germany
Age: 40 (M)
Posts: 26
easiest shove in my live

     
  15-Sep-13, 12:03   #19
  0 
Phisix 

Joined: May '13
Location: United Kingdom
Age: 30 (M)
Posts: 2216
I would prefer to wait and hope for any pocket pair or AX and push. Q9 I would shove as thats my favourite hand but I have never had much success playing J9 from position.

Enjoying these threads mate, keep them up.

     
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