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  16-Jul-13, 12:26   #1
PokerStars bans button hunter 0 
Sorin888 
Joined: Apr '11
Location: Romania
Age: 51 (M)
Posts: 2375
A high stakes pro has been handed am lifetime ban by PokerStars after repeatedly "buttoning" his opponents.
"Buttoning" is when a player sits down at an empty table, waits for it to fill up then leaves before paying the big blind. Continuous acts of "buttoning" are deemed as an angle-shoot.

Despite being formally warned, "Jama-dharma" continued to infringe PokerStars "buttoning" rule when playing at stakes ranging from $10/$20 to $1,000/$2,000.

That disregard for the rules has landed the high stakes pro a ban which means he will no longer be able to play his trade at PokerStars.

Indeed, although he'll be able to withdraw his bankroll, his account will now be completely blocked.

     
  16-Jul-13, 13:53   #2
  0 
ryanbighetty 

Joined: Nov '11
Location: Canada
Age: 23 (M)
Posts: 158
ohh wow that's crazy good to hear another cheater is gone from pokerstars good news didn't no that even poker pros can get blocked or banned from pokerstars can stars get banned from there

     
  16-Jul-13, 14:24   #3
  0 
demodawggy 

Joined: Feb '12
Location: Canada
Age: 56 (M)
Posts: 5682
I've never heard of THAT before...!!!!!

Although a very crafty thing to do,....I don't think it quite qualifies as being 'Cheating'...being that you are allowed to come and go as you wish,....but there is a rule in place for it though, so if you break the rules of the site,....which is a ''Private' thing,....it's their right to kick you off....and rightly so.

I agree with them for booting him out! Thumbs Up F'n idiot blew it for himself,...especially after being repeatedly warned....

Seems there's NOTHING on the face of the Earth that SOMEBODY won't find a way to bend the rules or cheat.... Thumbs Down

     
  16-Jul-13, 14:57   #4
  0 
marqis 

Joined: Sep '10
Location: Netherlands
Age: 48 (M)
Posts: 1631
I didn't know it was possible to play a hand without posting a blind first. If you jump in at a table that is already in progress, you have to wait for the big blind, or put the equivalent of the BB in the pot, if you don't want to wait.

Apparently it's different when you sit at an empty table, but even then you'll sometimes be the BB or SB when the first hand starts. This should only work when the tables fill up quickly enough, I suppose, or else you'll be playing heads up for a few hands, before the table is full. But still it is an edge, because most of the time you won't be in the BB or SB, and you'll be able to play a few "free" hands.

Crafty...

     
  16-Jul-13, 16:04   #5
  0 
Phisix 

Joined: May '13
Location: United Kingdom
Age: 30 (M)
Posts: 2216
Won't stop him going to other sites and doing that there though, but good on stars for doing that.

     
  16-Jul-13, 18:28   #6
  0 
pochui 

Joined: May '08
Location: Lithuania
Age: 32 (M)
Posts: 8638
very interesting strategy, i am tempted to try this at micro stakes, but still not quite sure if it's possible to do- if you sit down at an empty table, whenever your opponents joins you will be a sb or bb, so for this to work you must be joined by 2 or more players in the in a very short time frame (before any of the hands start?)...maybe will have a go at this when i have more than 1 cent in my account

     
  16-Jul-13, 18:33   #7
  0 
Mober 
Joined: Mar '09
Location: Greece
Age: 39 (F)
Posts: 10034
First time i ever hear about something like this.
Never thought that someone would exploit something like that.
But good thing that Poker Stars took some action against him.
Wonder how often he did it though, cause its hard to get it going.

     
  16-Jul-13, 20:02   #8
  0 
shokaku 

Joined: May '08
Location: Germany
Age: 51 (M)
Posts: 6233
Some people are only learning it the hard way. Looks like this guy is one of them. He can try his luck at iPoker or PP now. They may be slower in reacting.

     
  16-Jul-13, 21:00   #9
  0 
fcumred 

Joined: Apr '08
Location: United Kingdom
Age: 47 (M)
Posts: 1238
Sorry I just don't understand this. I fail to understand what he's doing that is so bad. He's not scamming anyone, or cheating. He doesn't benefit from it, so what precisely is the problem.

Anyone able to explain it simply to me...

     
  16-Jul-13, 21:52   #10
  0 
demodawggy 

Joined: Feb '12
Location: Canada
Age: 56 (M)
Posts: 5682
Posted by fcumred:
Sorry I just don't understand this. I fail to understand what he's doing that is so bad. He's not scamming anyone, or cheating. He doesn't benefit from it, so what precisely is the problem.

Anyone able to explain it simply to me...



He does benefit from it in that he keeps dodging the blinds, and doesn't have to lose chips to hands that MOST of the time will not connect to anything....

If you were to win EVERY or MOST hands where you were one of the blinds,....sure, you'd benefit....but in poker,....you WILL lose MOST hands if you played them all.

If you played EVERY blind when it came your way, you would lose,...and if you folded every blind, you would lose those chips....

So all in all,....he saves an AWFULL lot of money by keeping away from them....

Although not really cheating,...it's not ethical to just keep doing that. He broke the site's rules,....so the site booted him. Thumbs Up

     
  17-Jul-13, 00:47   #11
  0 
marqis 

Joined: Sep '10
Location: Netherlands
Age: 48 (M)
Posts: 1631
Posted by fcumred:
Sorry I just don't understand this. I fail to understand what he's doing that is so bad. He's not scamming anyone, or cheating. He doesn't benefit from it, so what precisely is the problem.

Anyone able to explain it simply to me...

If you were able to play hands without having to post blinds, you'd just fold every hand except AA or KK (which you'd push with). And there would be nothing that any of your opponents can do about it, except fold, thereby losing their blinds.

In reality you'll still start the first hand in SB or BB sometimes, but in any of the situations where you don't, you get an unfair advantage. You won't exactly play for free, but you pay fewer blinds than others.

I wonder if this is automatically detected by the software, or that someone has to notice it first...

Also, could there be some strategy for the software, to prevent this? Like making the first hand special, by requiring everyone to post a BB (like a form of straddle)? Or that a new table always starts with just 2 players (a SB and a BB), before letting others join?

Edited by marqis (Wednesday, July 17, 2013 @ 00:53 GMT)


     
  17-Jul-13, 02:20   #12
  0 
rbdflyboy 

Joined: Apr '11
Location: Canada
Age: 60 (M)
Posts: 1222
Just can't see how one can be dealt a hand without paying for it first, at least at a cash table. Even if one is sitting out, if one misses the BB then one can only play until after the BTN passes and one must ante up prior to reaching the BB. Has been this way for as long as memory severs me. If one is already in the game then sits out, then joins again, they will be dealt in again as long as they don't miss the BB.
The software has that covered with the "wait for BB" check off. If it's not checked then the ante is posted automatically and the cards dealt...this one is Confused

     
  17-Jul-13, 04:56   #13
  0 
shokaku 

Joined: May '08
Location: Germany
Age: 51 (M)
Posts: 6233
Posted by rbdflyboy:
Just can't see how one can be dealt a hand without paying for it first, at least at a cash table. Even if one is sitting out, if one misses the BB then one can only play until after the BTN passes and one must ante up prior to reaching the BB.

This does not apply, if the table is newly opened. Or otherwise no one would be able to play.

So he is basicly freerolling the other players. Playing a few hands for free, and leaving before it his turn to post the blinds.

     
  17-Jul-13, 05:41   #14
  0 
Macubaas 
Joined: Apr '11
Location: Romania
Age: 27 (M)
Posts: 6668
Never thought of that but frankly i do not see too many advantages...

One more thing i do not think he is a pro for real, i mean he definately has some money but he definately doesn't have enough to play with the big guys.

I remember Ihatejuice was also reporting people stealing his blinds at the high stakes limit holdem tables on which he was seated.

     
  17-Jul-13, 12:24   #15
  0 
shokaku 

Joined: May '08
Location: Germany
Age: 51 (M)
Posts: 6233
If i would NEVER have to post a blind, i would call this an advantage. But of cause he can't play a high number of hands an hour while running that trick

     
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