Joined: Sep '13
Location: Australia
Age: 29 (M)
Posts: 48
Well, I guess the saying "you can't bluff a donk" is true this is in a proper tournament 100fpp buy in on stars not some freeroll, anyway. How the F*#K can a legitimate player justify making this call, more importantly why was he even in the hand with the cards he had? I lead out on the turn and bombed the river and he tanked it for about 20 seconds and called me with middle pair, I think I played the bluff perfectly I represented the 10's great IMO, if you disagree, tell me how I could've played the hand better? Tips, etc, thanks!
Seat 1: 2yknz (1425 in chips) is sitting out Seat 2: Siames AA (1415 in chips) is sitting out Seat 3: brandonjason (1365 in chips) is sitting out Seat 4: chcknsab (3435 in chips) Seat 5: Mr.ERW (590 in chips) Seat 6: benjicleo (3450 in chips) Seat 7: terry2804 (965 in chips) Seat 8: diakson (1435 in chips) is sitting out Seat 9: holidayyyy (3860 in chips) benjicleo: posts small blind 25 terry2804: posts big blind 50 *** HOLE CARDS *** Dealt to benjicleo [2c 4c] diakson: folds holidayyyy: folds 2yknz: folds Siames AA: folds brandonjason: folds chcknsab: calls 50 Mr.ERW: folds benjicleo: calls 25 terry2804: raises 100 to 150 chcknsab: calls 100 benjicleo: calls 100 *** FLOP *** [5c 8h 9c] benjicleo: checks terry2804: bets 200 chcknsab: calls 200 benjicleo: calls 200 *** TURN *** [5c 8h 9c] benjicleo: bets 250 terry2804: calls 250 chcknsab: calls 250 *** RIVER *** [5c 8h 9c Ts] benjicleo: bets 1100 terry2804: folds chcknsab: calls 1100 *** SHOW DOWN *** benjicleo: shows [2c 4c] (a pair of Tens) chcknsab: shows [9s 4s] (two pair, Tens and Nines)
Joined: Feb '12
Location: Canada
Age: 64 (M)
Posts: 6036
Hey dude,....when it comes to those $H!T for brains assholes,....you can't play it any better or worse....
I saw 2 interviews with Daniel Negraneau,....and Doyle Brunson where they were asked about this kind of play that poker has turned into,....and they said there's really nothing you can do....
Joined: Apr '09
Location: Australia
Age: 40 (M)
Posts: 6483
Meh - ignoring everything else, I'd call you pretty much 100% on this river - if I found myself in his river spot.
And as you said yourself - 'you can't bluff a donk'.. More specifically if someone is a 'calling station', never try and 'out-think' them.. People lose a lot of chips doing that, trying to out-level somebodies thinking, it doesn't work, you'll just level yourself and then get angry at your opponent for not applying the level of thinking you critically assigned him.
Joined: Mar '11
Location: United Kingdom
Age: 55 (M)
Posts: 7371
The donks are everywhere {i'm one!}. but seriously you are better off playing against medium skilled players than the donks because you can predict more easily what the semi-skilled player will do than a donk anyday. Wouldnt it be nice to hear some of the explanations off these people to what they were thinking when they make the call. Donks are here to stay though so good luck to them
Joined: Oct '12
Location: Croatia
Age: 35 (M)
Posts: 267
Posted by Benjicleo: Well, I guess the saying "you can't bluff a donk" is true this is in a proper tournament 100fpp buy in on stars not some freeroll, anyway. How the F*#K can a legitimate player justify making this call, more importantly why was he even in the hand with the cards he had? I lead out on the turn and bombed the river and he tanked it for about 20 seconds and called me with middle pair, I think I played the bluff perfectly I represented the 10's great IMO, if you disagree, tell me how I could've played the hand better? Tips, etc, thanks!
Seat 1: 2yknz (1425 in chips) is sitting out Seat 2: Siames AA (1415 in chips) is sitting out Seat 3: brandonjason (1365 in chips) is sitting out Seat 4: chcknsab (3435 in chips) Seat 5: Mr.ERW (590 in chips) Seat 6: benjicleo (3450 in chips) Seat 7: terry2804 (965 in chips) Seat 8: diakson (1435 in chips) is sitting out Seat 9: holidayyyy (3860 in chips) benjicleo: posts small blind 25 terry2804: posts big blind 50 *** HOLE CARDS *** Dealt to benjicleo [2c 4c] diakson: folds holidayyyy: folds 2yknz: folds Siames AA: folds brandonjason: folds chcknsab: calls 50 Mr.ERW: folds benjicleo: calls 25 terry2804: raises 100 to 150 chcknsab: calls 100 benjicleo: calls 100 *** FLOP *** [5c 8h 9c] benjicleo: checks terry2804: bets 200 chcknsab: calls 200 benjicleo: calls 200 *** TURN *** [5c 8h 9c] benjicleo: bets 250 terry2804: calls 250 chcknsab: calls 250 *** RIVER *** [5c 8h 9c Ts] benjicleo: bets 1100 terry2804: folds chcknsab: calls 1100 *** SHOW DOWN *** benjicleo: shows [2c 4c] (a pair of Tens) chcknsab: shows [9s 4s] (two pair, Tens and Nines)
In online p oker you cant bluff because there is alot of bad player and calling everything even they don't have anything.
Maybe on last table of any tourney you can bluff it. Because on last table it supposed to be good players.
In this at least he had 9 it would be worse if he called on 5 (that he has only 5 in hand or something)
On stars you really need to have good hand to win because at least one per table will call every single cards
Joined: Apr '09
Location: Australia
Age: 40 (M)
Posts: 6483
Posted by doubletop777: but seriously you are better off playing against medium skilled players than the donks because you can predict more easily what the semi-skilled player will do than a donk anyday.
People say this a lot - it simply isn't true - the donks/fish/freerollers are the bottom of the barrel and hands-down the easiest to beat. If you can't figure out how to beat the games biggest losers, you're not going to have a better chance of beating semi-skilled players.. People love to think this.. but it just isn't true.
Joined: Sep '13
Location: Australia
Age: 29 (M)
Posts: 48
I was in the small blind and limped in for 25 more and called the big blinds raise of 100 chips because it was obvious it was just a positional raise and I knew he wasn't strong, after I flopped 2 clubs with 2 in my hand I wasn't going anywhere and when I missed I turned the hand into a bluff leading out on the 10 on the turn (top pair) and bombing the river for about 2/3 pot representing the set, why he was even in the hand with 9,4 I agree with you is absolutely shocking, but I can atleast justify why I was in the hand.
Joined: Aug '10
Location: Germany
Age: 52 (M)
Posts: 2219
It is really impssible to beat the masses of maniacs. Every time and every hand 3-4 Player all in. The only Chance is to wait the first Levels and Play only the best Hands. Then are many manicas eleminated and and the maniacs are the chip leader
Joined: May '11
Location: Netherlands
Age: 35 (M)
Posts: 141
Yeah sometimes you lose against such weird players, nothing to do about that. Keep in mind that next time your in such a hand you will win. Keep up the good work and maybe see you at the tables!
Joined: May '13
Location: United Kingdom
Age: 37 (M)
Posts: 2219
Perhaps he thought you were chasing a flush and you tried to bluff the 10s when you failed to hit the flush on the river so easy call in his mind. I had someone try that bluff on the river with me last night in a three way after one had gone all in and I folded because of the straight draw as well. Then again I wouldnt have played such cards in the SB myself.
Joined: Feb '11
Location: Germany
Age: 31 (M)
Posts: 1859
I'd consider your play alot worse than his in this hand. Consider own mistakes before raging about others play. Your preflop call is horrible,as well as the flop donkbet,makes no sense at all. As he played the hand this is an easy call on the river for him,folding would be terrible on his part. Also,calling a 100FPP MTT a "proper tournament" is hopefully a joke,100FPPs are worth $1.60 if not less (depending how you spend them)
You are right about not bluffing fish, it really is true. Experienced players know when to fold where fish will keep calling you in the hope of finding that card they are looking for. Eventually they will lose more often then win, but you can still go broke if you don't play it right. Show the nuts a few time and they will eventually fold some more.
Joined: Sep '13
Location: Australia
Age: 29 (M)
Posts: 48
Donket the flop? I checked the flop I wanted a free card I called when I picked up the flush draw and lead out on the turn because I realised incase I missed my flush that this was a good card to represent, and by "proper tournament" I mean not a freeroll, probably should've said that but none the less you're right it isn't a "proper tournament" so to speak (in terms of good/better players)
Joined: Apr '09
Location: Australia
Age: 40 (M)
Posts: 6483
Reading through the hand again, your play is actually a lot worse than his - you need to fold this hand preflop - every time.. If you really want to play it - then at least raise.. Completing the sb when you have junk is a fkn HUGE leak, seriously. Then flatting the raise is really bad too.. So is chasing your baby flush, OOP.
Everything about the way you played the hand was terrible - and bombing the river certainly didn't represent trips - because that isn't consistent with your story on the flop.. What 10-X hand were you check/calling the flop with?
Joined: Sep '13
Location: Australia
Age: 29 (M)
Posts: 48
A,10, suited connectors like 9,10 or one gapers 8,10 plenty of hands where check calling that flop that aren't worthy of a preflop raise IMO I think I played it quite well and a better player would've folded middle pair no kicker, and my baby flush? Any flush is basically the nuts heads up and or 3 handed
