Joined: Aug '13
Location: United Kingdom
Age: 58 (M)
Posts: 17
Hello there, I have been playing for around a year, won't reveal everything but I have been playing $10 and $5 SNGs and MTTs and have busted it all. I have made effort almost daily to study the strategy behind beating these games, to ICM, to EV, to push/fold ranging, to reading player's tendencies and just building personal experience. But I have not been able to turn any profit at all. I admit, I lost my last $50 due to tilt but it took me hours and days to break even - I know the game is beatable so does it just mean I have not put in enough game time or research? Maybe it's just bad variance since I've barely played 1K hands yet. But for those young phenoms who deposited $50 cluelessly and made profit - did it mean they had to be lucky in the beginning playing $5 games 10 years back? Feedback would be great. Doesn't have to be an answer just a discussion thread.
Joined: Mar '11
Location: Croatia
Age: 43 (M)
Posts: 1738
Hi, First to say I'm just a recreational player and even thou I enjoy playing poker, I've never been too keen to read about strategy and numbers. I take the game for what it is, just a game and all the "knowledge" and "strategies" I might apply all come from the experience I've gathered for the last 3 years since I started playing.
I've managed to make a small profit over time ( ridiculously small considering the time that I spend playing) but I think it comes from more from my approach to the game then from my poker skills. I grind micro stakes all formats and always try to invest less then what i win. Resuming, winning or losing i stick to my buy-ins and grind grind grind forever. Most times i break even but I know that playing like that wont ever take me anywhere...
Definitely luck plays a major part in poker but that's part of it's fascination isn't it? In my best result to date I played the most terrible poker. I kept track on how many times I've misread opponents and was behind all the way till the river. 12 times I've should have went busto but the river saved my hand. Kept doubling up till the final table where finally i was taken out in 2nd place.
I cannot say what you are doing wrong, maybe ur trying too hard, maybe ur not trying enough.. Probably it comes down to your br management and luck overall. Don't try to get rich overnight.. to many people want that from poker and there's a long waiting line.. Either play for the fun and grind what u can afford, or, try a big tourney here and there.. dont expect much from it thou, probably you wont do good ( not because of you but because of everyone else) but who knows, maybe one time you'll hit the jackpot.
Joined: Nov '13
Location: United Kingdom
Age: 41 (M)
Posts: 27
$250 bankroll is not big enough for $10 SnG, sure you can try a couple of games but once your bankroll got to $200 you should have dropped down a level probably to $2 SnG's.
When your bankroll got to $100, I would have played $1 SnG max, then at $50 just $0.50 SnG.
What are your stats? If your VPIP% is above 10-15% when there are 8-9 players, you are too loose. I usually don't play a hand until there are only 7 players left, unless I have AA or KK.
Are you finishing on the bubble too often when you are not the short stack?
Joined: Jun '11
Location: United Kingdom
Age: 52 (M)
Posts: 1332
Hi AceMilo, the one thing to remember "poker takes a minute to learn but a lifetime to master" Just keep reading up and play smaller stakes for a while,try some small dons (returns are bad but it gives you a better understanding of s'n'gs. With mtts try some sats to save stakes,getting into bigger tourneys with a little stakes takes the pressure off your bankroll,you might be more relaxed with not as much at risk. Also maybe read up a little on bankroll management and have some patience.......good luck to you on and off the felts and to all the other mobsters out there...
Joined: Feb '12
Location: Latvia
Age: 31 (M)
Posts: 258
Have you hear something about like this - Never play highter stakes then 1% of your bankroll ? That means if you have 250$ you should be playing 2.5$ SNG and MTT tournaments and nothing more then that ...
I agree with the above. $5 buyins to learn the game, makes for an expensive education. Did you even try to start at the lowest buyin, only moving up, after making a profit over a few thousand games?
Making money playing poker is difficult. I believe it's less than 10% of players that turn a profit, which makes sense if you see how much rake is taken, and how much money goes into promotions (all paid for by the players).
You've only lost $250, which is not that much at those stakes, so you probably are doing 10 things right and only one or two things wrong. It's just that one leak is usually enough to lose all of your profits...
Joined: Mar '09
Location: Portugal
Age: 57 (M)
Posts: 1703
Man that is poker a rollercoaster of emotions the best you handle them the better you will do.For me one of the great problems it´s the pressure of winning back the losts to fast when we start to woory about the bankroll we make stupid choices and a slump is on the way Been there done that more times that I wished for me the solution is back to basics
Joined: Nov '11
Location: Romania
Age: 34 (M)
Posts: 754
Hello, Try to play in small tourney / sng / ring games. Try not to play on Saturday / Sunday day time. Learn about your opponents. If you loose constantly in some tourney, JUST STOP that day and play another day.
Joined: Apr '11
Location: Romania
Age: 35 (M)
Posts: 6669
If you played 10 dollar tournaments with just a 250 dollars bankroll, here is a pretty good answer. You basically did not respect the first rule of poker: bankroll management....
For tournaments you should have at least 100 buy ins for the limit you are playing. Add a bit of tilt to your game and you have your answer.
Joined: Aug '13
Location: United Kingdom
Age: 58 (M)
Posts: 17
Posted by marqis: I agree with the above. $5 buyins to learn the game, makes for an expensive education.
You've hit the nail on the head - but it is the most effective way. I have enough knowledge of the game to know that I can play $5 games and $10 games and they are in my skill level. To apply BRM, I would have to play hours for cents. I have made the effort to skip that stage because I don't want to waste my time playing ABC poker when I know I play at least level 3 of thinking in poker. ( see levels of thinking in poker) and many others have started from low stakes not micro, back in 2004 when $5 was the lowest stakes offered by any site.
Joined: Apr '09
Location: Australia
Age: 40 (M)
Posts: 6483
Posted by AceMilo: Hello there, I have been playing for around a year, won't reveal everything but I have been playing $10 and $5 SNGs and MTTs and have busted it all. I have made effort almost daily to study the strategy behind beating these games, to ICM, to EV, to push/fold ranging, to reading player's tendencies and just building personal experience. But I have not been able to turn any profit at all. I admit, I lost my last $50 due to tilt but it took me hours and days to break even - I know the game is beatable so does it just mean I have not put in enough game time or research? Maybe it's just bad variance since I've barely played 1K hands yet. But for those young phenoms who deposited $50 cluelessly and made profit - did it mean they had to be lucky in the beginning playing $5 games 10 years back? Feedback would be great. Doesn't have to be an answer just a discussion thread.
How do you lose $250 plying $5-$10 SNGs/MTTs and have barely played 1000 hands? That doesn't add up my friend.
Joined: Feb '14
Location: Mauritius
Age: 34 (M)
Posts: 103
Posted by AceMilo:
Posted by marqis: I agree with the above. $5 buyins to learn the game, makes for an expensive education.
You've hit the nail on the head - but it is the most effective way. I have enough knowledge of the game to know that I can play $5 games and $10 games and they are in my skill level. To apply BRM, I would have to play hours for cents. I have made the effort to skip that stage because I don't want to waste my time playing ABC poker when I know I play at least level 3 of thinking in poker. ( see levels of thinking in poker) and many others have started from low stakes not micro, back in 2004 when $5 was the lowest stakes offered by any site.
By playing at the level like you're actually playing, you will never beat low stakes sitngo nor cash games if you don't apply bankroll management so my advice is that you should only play tournaments in this case and only $5 or lower buy ins as $10 is too much and you'll go broke for sure. Good luck
Joined: May '13
Location: Mauritius
Age: 32 (M)
Posts: 2688
Nah well you have to work on your mind games looks like you are working hard enough but not progressing maybe you losing money because of some tilt then and there , you should remove the tilt from your game, if you cannot play your A game do not play , and do not play when tired. Also i hope that this is not variance if it is, you cannot do anything about it and just have to sucks it up and hope for the better in the nest few games. If not you should be able to cope with it with a health bankroll. Cheers!
Joined: Feb '11
Location: Germany
Age: 31 (M)
Posts: 1859
Dropping $250 in $5 and $10 SNGs is normal. Also, if your sample is that small, you shouldn't worry about your results, it can all still be variance. What kind of SNGs are you playing on what site?
Joined: Feb '11
Location: United Kingdom
Age: 59 (M)
Posts: 5712
A lot depends really on whether losing 250$ is an issue for you. If it was 250 deposit, then maybe it may be, but as it looks like you grew this 250 from very little, it probably does not hurt you. Bank roll management is essential. If you don't want to practice bankroll management then you don't mind losing the money. That's ok, cos if you went out on Saturday night, had a load of beer and food you would lose more than playing poker. If you want to win, then manage your bankroll.
Joined: May '08
Location: Lithuania
Age: 39 (M)
Posts: 10090
question: What am I doing wrong? $250 -> $0
answer: ok so not getting very deeply into mathematical equations and in-depth correlations of in-between action at and around poker sites i suspect that the main issue i see here (and believe me, i know what i'm talking about) is that you are losing money.
Joined: Mar '11
Location: United Kingdom
Age: 55 (M)
Posts: 7371
You could always try dropping down a few levels to just get your confidence back up. I am a great believer in the more confidence you have, the better decisions you will make and maybe turn your fortunes around. Good luck on whatever you decide
