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  11-Sep-14, 17:43   #1
Double or nothing tournaments 0 
av1966 
Joined: Mar '09
Location: Portugal
Age: 50 (M)
Posts: 1500
Hello guys some questions on DoN´s?
Have you ever been able to win, sitting out the whole game?
Is there a method of playing it best for most cases?
While I'd like to get a big stack early and relax for the rest of it, I am still not sure of how to ensure that
Assuming the tables start with ten players, with a starting chip stack of 1500 , I try to get a decent stack (2500+) and sit out, there's no reason to keep playing when im not in danger of blinding away by the end.. that has worked best for me. Worship Worship Worship
What do you think about it ?

     
  11-Sep-14, 18:33   #2
  0 
Pattalan 

Joined: Mar '13
Location: United Kingdom
Age: 24 (M)
Posts: 60
answered your own thread.

     
  11-Sep-14, 18:40   #3
  0 
DDPascalDD 
Joined: Jan '14
Location: Netherlands
Age: 26 (M)
Posts: 508
Posted by av1966:
Hello guys some questions on DoN's?
Have you ever been able to win, sitting out the whole game?


No I never tried and I first always wanted to but now I think the blinds are too slow and the players go bust too slow and you thus can't get ITM.

It's by the way a very non-risk SnG if you are good at them, then you can almost always double up (despite the fee of course).

Blinding out can work, but when you got almost blinded away, you have too few chips to get a decent stack again and you are busted too soon. So try to play again when your stack is about 5BB and play a few hands. I reckon it'll work out better but I'm not sire as it is long ago since I played them regularly.

     
  11-Sep-14, 20:06   #4
  +2 
Twistyoursou 

Joined: Jan '14
Location: Portugal
Age: 49 (M)
Posts: 271
Sitting out is just dumb in my opinion (no offense Big Smile). Just keep playing man. You can still fold every hand, and get walks from other players since they know you're playing. And while sitting out you just muck AA, and my gut tells me that that isn't profitable Big Smile But if something works for you, who am I to tell you to do something different? Big Smile Good luck Blink

     
  11-Sep-14, 21:56   #5
  0 
hazeform 
Joined: Jan '11
Location: Germany
Age: 42 (M)
Posts: 506
not a good strategy imo...try to double up early can also kill you early !
of course it is nice to double up early but more important is to survive to beat the rake
and make a profit in the long run

cheers



     
  11-Sep-14, 22:37   #6
  0 
mgabesz 
Joined: Mar '11
Location: Hungary
Age: 32 (M)
Posts: 153
At Pokerstars for example you cannot play your hand if you are on sit out because you are forced to fold and opponent gets whole pot just by default. Only exclusion is forced all-in lottery style tourneys which are not original tourneys when in a one-hand tournament all players forced to be all-in every round because blinds are increase every hand and cover all stack of every player.

------------
Other thing about this tournament that only ipoker super turbo and surprise jackpot sit and gos cash out at least ten percent. Other times you will get lot more fewer amount than double amount of the buy-in exactly. But GL of course.

Edited by mgabesz (Thursday, September 11, 2014 @ 22:54 GMT)


     
  12-Sep-14, 01:04   #7
  0 
marqis 

Joined: Sep '10
Location: Netherlands
Age: 48 (M)
Posts: 1631
Posted by hazeform:
not a good strategy imo...try to double up early can also kill you early !
of course it is nice to double up early but more important is to survive to beat the rake
and make a profit in the long run

Seems to me that this is correct.

As soon as you get in a coinflip situation for all your chips, you've lost already. Since a 50% chance on less than a double up, is a losing proposition, and that is just one hand; you might not even make it even after winning that hand.

I'm no expert, but the regs seem to play very tight early on, and try to steal blinds when they've increased enough to make it worthwhile.

I think some percentage of the winrate of regs is just not risking any chips early on, so that the lesser players have either doubled up or busted out. So I do think they win without playing a single hand every once in a while...

     
  12-Sep-14, 07:36   #8
  0 
BeMyATMplz 
Joined: Feb '11
Location: Germany
Age: 23 (M)
Posts: 1854
Posted by marqis:
Posted by hazeform:
not a good strategy imo...try to double up early can also kill you early !
of course it is nice to double up early but more important is to survive to beat the rake
and make a profit in the long run

Seems to me that this is correct.

As soon as you get in a coinflip situation for all your chips, you've lost already. Since a 50% chance on less than a double up, is a losing proposition, and that is just one hand; you might not even make it even after winning that hand.

I'm no expert, but the regs seem to play very tight early on, and try to steal blinds when they've increased enough to make it worthwhile.

I think some percentage of the winrate of regs is just not risking any chips early on, so that the lesser players have either doubled up or busted out. So I do think they win without playing a single hand every once in a while...
Yup, a lot of good points in this post. Basicly what you have to consider in ICM perspective in DONs is that your chips aren't worth as much as in a rrgular SNG if you are a bigstack, so there is no reason trying to become the bigstack early on. The main point is surviving. Non-showdown winnings and knowing the right spots to get them is the key. Being in coinflips or having even less than 50% equity is something that will happen, because shoving ranges are always wider than calling ranges. 50/50s on stars on the other hand are completely different. There being the bigstack often is the only way to get a good winrate. A good Reg who plays mid/highstakes on stars said 50/50s should be analyzed in a 60/10/10/10/10 payout structure rather than DON structure.

     
  12-Sep-14, 08:06   #9
  0 
Theapple 

Joined: Sep '13
Location: Bosnia and Herzegovina
Age: 29 (M)
Posts: 1552
no. just no. might as well not bother playing those if you want to sitout, imo

     
  12-Sep-14, 09:05   #10
  0 
Calmplay 

Joined: Apr '08
Location: Mauritius
Age: 52 (M)
Posts: 3698
Posted by Twistyoursou:
Sitting out is just dumb in my opinion (no offense Big Smile). Just keep playing man. You can still fold every hand, and get walks from other players since they know you're playing. And while sitting out you just muck AA, and my gut tells me that that isn't profitable Big Smile But if something works for you, who am I to tell you to do something different? Big Smile Good luck Blink


+1 Thumbs Up

     
  12-Sep-14, 09:58   #11
  0 
monika0718 

Joined: Dec '10
Location: Hungary
Age: 37 (F)
Posts: 7
I like DON, easy money Smile

     
  12-Sep-14, 14:08   #12
  0 
Twistyoursou 

Joined: Jan '14
Location: Portugal
Age: 49 (M)
Posts: 271
Posted by monika0718:
I like DON, easy money Smile


You don't like something because it's easy money? o.O Well you're a weird human.

     
  12-Sep-14, 14:35   #13
  +1 
zeroster 

Joined: May '11
Location: United Kingdom
Age: 51 (M)
Posts: 1372
Posted by Twistyoursou:
Posted by monika0718:
I like DON, easy money Smile


You don't like something because it's easy money? o.O Well you're a weird human.


My dad's called Don, I like him.

     
  12-Sep-14, 16:18   #14
  0 
Mober 
Joined: Mar '09
Location: Greece
Age: 39 (F)
Posts: 10034
Yes it happens. But not sitting out completely. Just folding almost every hand, because with the number of active polayers in the game and when i am saying active i mean those who
go for the first place Smile there is no need to risk it sometimes.
You just let them fight for it Smile

Should have read the whole post Smile
Scratch that, it wasnt about tournaments Smile

     
  13-Sep-14, 12:44   #15
  0 
Twistyoursou 

Joined: Jan '14
Location: Portugal
Age: 49 (M)
Posts: 271
I somehow read I don't like DON... I'm sorry for the comment Monika. You no longer classify as a weird human (: I need to stop reading forums late at night Big Smile

     
  13-Sep-14, 12:58   #16
  0 
mirexxx 
Joined: Sep '11
Location: Bosnia and Herzegovina
Age: 33 (M)
Posts: 2728
Watch your opponents, grinders will be folding 95% of hands here while those new to the game will raise or call with a wider range. Find out who is only playing top hands and avoid them later in the game.
Fold all but premium hands in early position and avoid flat calling raises from any position, reraising with monsters. Big-pot hands such as small pairs can be limped behind from later positions, however if a player yet to act has shown themselves to be aggressive this should also be avoided.
Preserving your stack is key in the first few blind levels. This gives opponents the opportunity to bust each other, while maintaining the threat of a large raise during the middle stages.

     
  13-Sep-14, 13:57   #17
  0 
shokaku 

Joined: May '08
Location: Germany
Age: 51 (M)
Posts: 6233
Do the opposite to what the rest of the table does. If they are active, try to be out of the way as much as possible. If they play as tight as advocated here, it may be a good idea to steal all those blinds no one wants.

     
  13-Sep-14, 14:36   #18
  0 
Heskor 
Joined: May '13
Location: Mauritius
Age: 25 (M)
Posts: 2659
Yeah looks like you answered your own post lol, it happens to me sometime too , i asked a question but in the same post i answer it lol. My strategy is a bit like yours go hard and fast at the start then wait for players to kick themselves out and then be at the top 50 % and wins. But if the tables is nitty i will raise some good hands and playable one just to get some chips in and steals most of the tie also preferable to fold some cards like JJ in some spot if you have several people in the pot! Good luck mate!

     
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