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  26-Oct-14, 20:28   #1
Playing staked vs. playing on own bankroll +1 
BeMyATMplz 
Joined: Feb '11
Location: Germany
Age: 23 (M)
Posts: 1854
I don't often open threads on here, but I think this is a serious topic.

For the last couple months I've been playing staked, I got staked for SNGs up to $15s, a stake I was very happy to be able to play at again after a long time at the beginning.
However, the problem is simply the profit split.
Most stakes are 50/50, and that includes everything you play, as well as FPP satellites, freerolls and all that stuff. If you get coached in return of profits, fine, but if you play 50/50 with proven results without coaching then it's simply a steal.
This really is a pain in the ass tbh.
You see yourself making nice profits, which would be a very good side income every month. Instead you barely make enough to have a fun night once every 2 weeks from your poker earnings.
Not only your normal profits get split, no, even the freeroll winings you make aren't yours.

So I decided to quit my stake. I will have to start from scratch now or something, because I simply don't have any money to deposit until end of november or so.
But what I recommend - do not play staked, no matter what, if you are a consistent winning player. All it does is limiting yourself.

Edited by BeMyATMplz (Sunday, October 26, 2014 @ 20:39 GMT)


     
  26-Oct-14, 20:39   #2
  0 
teddybears73 
Joined: Nov '11
Location: United Kingdom
Age: 59 (M)
Posts: 3175
I suppose that's a problem when you are being staked by someone,you can't pick and choose what to split it has to be everything.A bit different from someone just buying you into a tourney where you only pay him/her if you cash in that particular one.Really the best way is not to be staked and just play with your own money,maybe it's a bit hard for some people to do that so i guess that's the price you pay for being staked.
From reading your previous posts you sound like a guy who knows how to play poker so maybe it would be best for you not to take any proper staking offers.Anyway good luck with whatever you choose. Thumbs Up

     
  26-Oct-14, 20:46   #3
  0 
DirkSchering 

Joined: Oct '14
Location: Germany
Age: 26 (M)
Posts: 29
Maybe is chipmeup.com what for you, you decide how you split and what kind of games you play. You can even play 50% with your own money and 50% with the rest.

     
  26-Oct-14, 20:49   #4
  0 
marqis 

Joined: Sep '10
Location: Netherlands
Age: 48 (M)
Posts: 1631
I've never really understood why a winning player would want to give away half of their profit, unless it involves coaching.
Maybe if you want to limit your risk, when moving up in levels?

How come you don't have money to bankroll yourself? Simply don't withdraw anything more than what would leave you with a proper bankroll...

I mean, if you are a carpenter, you would not sell your tools, when you need money, because without them you'd be unable to earn money in the future, jeopardizing your livelihood...

     
  26-Oct-14, 20:55   #5
  0 
BeMyATMplz 
Joined: Feb '11
Location: Germany
Age: 23 (M)
Posts: 1854
Posted by marqis:

How come you don't have money to bankroll yourself? Simply don't withdraw anything more than what would leave you with a proper bankroll...



Simply all I have till the end of november is poker earnings, I'm a trainee but my wage for that won't come till the end of november because the people responsible are just that slow (but that's a different story).
If I had a regular income then I'd probably not withdraw anything except to buy something bigger (new computer, travel etc., you get what I mean), but I was and am simply not in the situation to do that because I have to pay 100€/month to my school for example. My luck is that my family lends me this, but other than that pokermoney is all I have, for the last 2 months and for another month now.

If you have a regular job then it's easy to say "just withdraw "here and then"" etc., but some people have different life stuations that aren't even their fault.

     
  26-Oct-14, 21:14   #6
  0 
yout85 
Joined: May '12
Location: United Kingdom
Age: 31 (M)
Posts: 2016
Posted by BeMyATMplz:
but some people have different life stuations that aren't even their fault.


Yeah ^^ this.

I do have a regular job... and do consider myself to be a good player - but the thought of being staked has always appealed to me.

I am yet to talk to anyone who has been staked that has recommended it to me, so I've always avoided it... but still the idea intrigues me.

     
  26-Oct-14, 21:17   #7
  0 
teddybears73 
Joined: Nov '11
Location: United Kingdom
Age: 59 (M)
Posts: 3175
Posted by DirkSchering:
Maybe is chipmeup.com what for you, you decide how you split and what kind of games you play. You can even play 50% with your own money and 50% with the rest.



Welcome to the forum Dirk, i hope your stay is a happy and fruitful one. Thumbs Up

     
  26-Oct-14, 22:52   #8
  0 
jovicakralj 

Joined: Nov '10
Location: Serbia
Age: 29 (M)
Posts: 2075
Hey bemy. Does that means that Im not going to keep seeing you at my tables? GOOD Big Smile
Well, I was thinking about staking and I came to same conclusion as you did. If you are established player in SNGs I just cant see any reason to take staking offer for limits that you are already proven on. I can see staking as reasonable for MTTs (since there are terrible downswings on those) and for playing bigger limits then you used to play (at least double then regular stakes). Also, I'm sure you can get way better deal then that. I would give you 60/40 in your favor any time. For example I know guy (he was in top 5 MTT leader board on stars last year) and he gets 60%-40% in his favor and he plays NO LIMIT MTTs (including 5k buy in). So, im sure there can be lot better deals out there. Anyway for 15$ 6max regular, 500$ bankroll could be enough easy.
Can you precisely tell me how staking worked. Im interested to hear details, and maybe we can discuss even some deal between us perhaps.

     
  27-Oct-14, 00:26   #9
  0 
RoninHarper 

Joined: Nov '12
Location: Canada
Age: 48 (M)
Posts: 4440
Posted by BeMyATMplz:
I don't often open threads on here, but I think this is a serious topic.

For the last couple months I've been playing staked, I got staked for SNGs up to $15s, a stake I was very happy to be able to play at again after a long time at the beginning.
However, the problem is simply the profit split.
Most stakes are 50/50, and that includes everything you play, as well as FPP satellites, freerolls and all that stuff. If you get coached in return of profits, fine, but if you play 50/50 with proven results without coaching then it's simply a steal.
This really is a pain in the ass tbh.
You see yourself making nice profits, which would be a very good side income every month. Instead you barely make enough to have a fun night once every 2 weeks from your poker earnings.
Not only your normal profits get split, no, even the freeroll winings you make aren't yours.

So I decided to quit my stake. I will have to start from scratch now or something, because I simply don't have any money to deposit until end of november or so.
But what I recommend - do not play staked, no matter what, if you are a consistent winning player. All it does is limiting yourself.


G'day mate

Do understand your above post correctly?
What I think I am reading is that because you have chosen to walk away from your staking deal, you now have no bankroll and can not make any deposit until December.
Does this mean you will be forced to only play freerolls?
I ask you this because I might be able to help you out somewhat.
Please let me know if I am correct and exactly what your situation is so that I might try to help you.
wishing you the very best
be cool

Ronin Cool

     
  27-Oct-14, 00:43   #10
  0 
Twistyoursou 

Joined: Jan '14
Location: Portugal
Age: 49 (M)
Posts: 271
From what I understood, that is in fact the case Ronin. He said no deposits until the end of november.

You did well quitting in my opinion. With your talent, you'll easily build a bankroll without much effort, as you must be aware yourself ( meaning 100% of them profits Big Smile ).

Run good. Blink

     
  27-Oct-14, 01:49   #11
  -1 
RoninHarper 

Joined: Nov '12
Location: Canada
Age: 48 (M)
Posts: 4440
Posted by Twistyoursou:

You did well quitting in my opinion. With your talent, you'll easily build a bankroll without much effort, as you must be aware yourself ( meaning 100% of them profits Big Smile ).

Run good. Blink


G'day mate

Was the above quote meant for me or for BeMyATMplz ?
I have not quit but I did really scale things back alot.
wishing you all the very best mate
be cool

Ronin Cool

     
  27-Oct-14, 07:51   #12
  0 
pochui 

Joined: May '08
Location: Lithuania
Age: 32 (M)
Posts: 8628
if you are really confident of your ability to be a constant long term winner, then take a bank loan- it's just ~10% annual interest so you're basically getting a 90-10 staking deal with bank and get to keep the winnings from freerolls, fpp sats...

     
  27-Oct-14, 07:53   #13
  0 
Twistyoursou 

Joined: Jan '14
Location: Portugal
Age: 49 (M)
Posts: 271
Half the post was meant for you, but not that part Blink that was in fact meant for BeMyATMplz.

Be cool Big Smile Big Smile

     
  27-Oct-14, 08:18   #14
  0 
schmoyster 
Joined: Jul '09
Location: Russian Federation
Age: 47 (M)
Posts: 758
BeMyATMplz, you never mentioned your infinite poker objective. Do you want to earn money with poker? Become a pro? A semi-pro?

If yes, then staking is a fine instrument of professional growth. It gives you a bankroll and a chance to attempt limits which will be outside your range if you play with your own money. I don't doubt, that you understand the money value of time. If you cancel the staking deal, you will have to start with freerolls and 1.00 - 1.50 donkaments on PS (where you play, as far as I recollect). Being a good player you will build your bankroll but it will take time. And time has money value. May be there is an option here to negotiate a better staking deal?

And if you are a recreational player, then why bother about staking at all?

     
  27-Oct-14, 13:06   #15
  0 
RoninHarper 

Joined: Nov '12
Location: Canada
Age: 48 (M)
Posts: 4440
Posted by BeMyATMplz:
Posted by marqis:

How come you don't have money to bankroll yourself? Simply don't withdraw anything more than what would leave you with a proper bankroll...



Simply all I have till the end of november is poker earnings, I'm a trainee but my wage for that won't come till the end of november because the people responsible are just that slow (but that's a different story).
If I had a regular income then I'd probably not withdraw anything except to buy something bigger (new computer, travel etc., you get what I mean), but I was and am simply not in the situation to do that because I have to pay 100�/month to my school for example. My luck is that my family lends me this, but other than that pokermoney is all I have, for the last 2 months and for another month now.

If you have a regular job then it's easy to say "just withdraw "here and then"" etc., but some people have different life stuations that aren't even their fault.


G'day mate

Hope you are still reading this thread and have read my post.
let me know if I can help amigo
I have faith in you.
wishing you all the best
be cool

Ronin Cool

     
  27-Oct-14, 13:23   #16
  0 
yout85 
Joined: May '12
Location: United Kingdom
Age: 31 (M)
Posts: 2016
I don't think you could go far wrong staking BeMyATMplz... very solid player, capable of large volume = the perfect horse.

But then... this entire thread is about his dislike of being staked and the problems it causes, so I doubt he'll want to get into that again.

I'd be able to help you out getting a starting bankroll if you need it BeMy (wanting nothing in return)... You've got my email address, so feel free to ask anything you want.

     
  27-Oct-14, 13:23   #17
  0 
vsemoje 
Joined: Feb '13
Location: Slovenia
Age: 34 (M)
Posts: 515
i totally understand u...
I have been playing under stake for a year and felt the same..
When i saw i made almost 3k for stakers i quit Smile
And i have same problem as u.... I live from winnings so i have problem with depositing and climbing stakes.
hope u get proper Br so u can play on your own Smile

     
  27-Oct-14, 15:52   #18
  0 
RoninHarper 

Joined: Nov '12
Location: Canada
Age: 48 (M)
Posts: 4440
Posted by vsemoje:
i totally understand u...
I have been playing under stake for a year and felt the same..
When i saw i made almost 3k for stakers i quit Smile
And i have same problem as u.... I live from winnings so i have problem with depositing and climbing stakes.
hope u get proper Br so u can play on your own Smile


G'day mates

I hope my post has not been misleading.
I am NOT offering to stake BeMyATMplz.
I was think more along the lines of a 1 time cash infusion of some cash to help him get a new starting bankroll together.
I would be making this as a gift with NO Strings attached at all!
I was thinking I might be able to give him $25 - $50 USD.
Wishing you all the best
be cool

Ronin Cool

     
  27-Oct-14, 16:09   #19
  0 
vsemoje 
Joined: Feb '13
Location: Slovenia
Age: 34 (M)
Posts: 515
@roninharper
nothin was about ur post Smile
just reply to Beatmplz caus i know how he feels Smile

gl vsemoje

     
  28-Oct-14, 10:16   #20
  0 
BeMyATMplz 
Joined: Feb '11
Location: Germany
Age: 23 (M)
Posts: 1854
Thanks everyone for their posts.
Ronin I really appreciate the offer but I wouldn't want something like that as "gift". Would at least want to go over some HHs in return, or return the $ once I can deposit myself. Yout I thought you have similar troubles as well right now? But if we can figure something out, let me know and I'll mail you or something Smile

     
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