Joined: May '12
Location: United Kingdom
Age: 38 (M)
Posts: 2064
Purely copied from another forum... which I'll call "Slanted-book" as to not advertise BRMs rivals
This is not a response to me, but I find it interesting still:
"Thank you for taking the time to share your concerns with us. In recent weeks, PokerStars has made several changes which have upset some players. We have heard these complaints and are genuinely listening to the feedback. No one likes higher costs and we appreciate that point of view. In recent years, we have also heard many high-volume, professional poker players say that the games are tougher now and it’s harder to win than in the past. This is one of the reasons we have actually reduced rake, which helps the ROI of these players. But that’s not making the games any softer, which is what would really improve ROI. Instead, we need to invest in new ways to improve the poker economy. Over recent years, we have been developing ways to grow that we believe will attract new players and reactivate players already in our database. Such initiatives include new poker variants, expansion into other gaming verticals, and new marketing approaches. While we understand that not all players are satisfied with the short-term impact of these changes, the reality is they have the potential to increase poker liquidity. However, initiatives to attract players require significant investments in areas of marketing, promotions and product innovation. Additionally, in order to not only secure our continued place as an industry leader across the globe but also to grow ourselves and the game globally, we continue to lobby for the regulation of online poker and attempt to obtain licenses in many newly regulated, locally licensed jurisdictions. We support regulation because we believe it ensures game integrity, player protection, and increases the recognized legitimacy for the game itself. However, there are obviously significant upfront costs to these efforts as well as ongoing costs in the form of gaming license fees and duties. The funding has to come from many places and it is perfectly reasonable that some of it comes from reducing certain costs, which was the rationale for some of the changes to our VIP program, stemming from a review we began early this year, as well as charging a margin on currency exchange fees. It is also the rationale for our changes to the rake. If we can grow poker, everyone will benefit. Even our competitors will benefit, because in a rising tide, all ships rise. Finally, it has to be said that our rake, our currency exchange rates and our VIP program are all more competitive than those of our major competitors. Let us know if there is anything else that we can help you with. Marika P. PokerStars Support Team"
Joined: Oct '12
Location: Ukraine
Age: 58 (M)
Posts: 296
Hi, everybody.
The politician Pokerstars after they practically disorganized network functioning an ipoker and 888Poker is directed on that to dictate the terms and to have more profit. And anybody, in their opinion, shouldn't excite consequences of their marketing mixes.
They now almost uniform owners and monopolists in this market of poker business.
Joined: May '12
Location: United Kingdom
Age: 38 (M)
Posts: 2064
A more honest reply would've been:
"Thank you for taking the time to share your concerns with us. In recent weeks, PokerStars has made several changes which have upset some players. We have heard these complaints and are genuinely not in the slightest bit bothered. No one, except us, like higher costs and we appreciate that point of view, but again, don't care. In recent years, we have also heard many high-volume, professional poker players say that the games are tougher now and it’s harder to win than in the past. These people are whining pussies, so we choose to totally ignore what they have to say. Instead, we need to invest in new ways to improve the poker economy... and why should we have to pay for that? I mean, come on guys... we're only worth a few billion, and the changes will purely benefit us - so shut up and stump up as our stash of Cuban cigars is running low. Over recent years, we (well, to be honest - the previous owners) have been developing ways to grow that we (they) believe(d) will attract new players and reactivate players already in our (their) database. Such initiatives include new poker variants (casino games), expansion into other gaming verticals (casino games), and new marketing approaches (advertising casino games). While we understand that not all players are satisfied with the short-term impact of these changes, the reality is that we don't care. While we claim they have the potential to increase poker liquidity, this is just a meaningless platitude designed to confuse our more stupid customers. Initiatives to attract players require significant investments in areas of marketing, promotions and product innovation. Additionally, in order to not only secure our continued place as an industry leader and our pensions... we continue to lobby for the regulation of online poker and attempt to obtain licenses in many newly regulated, locally licensed jurisdictions, to exploit more and more people. We support regulation because we believe it ensures game integrity, player protection, and increases the recognized legitimacy for the game itself... and increases our profit margins. However, there are obviously significant upfront costs to these efforts as well as ongoing costs in the form of gaming license fees and duties, and again we can not seriously be expected to pay for our own business costs. The funding has to come from many places and it is perfectly reasonable that some of it comes from reducing certain costs, which was the rationale for some of the changes to our VIP program, stemming from a review we began early this year, as well as charging a margin on currency exchange fees - because basically, we thought "why not hurt the people who help us most?". It is also the rationale for our changes to the rake (kerching). If we can grow poker, everyone will benefit, ESPECIALLY us. Even our competitors will benefit, because in a rising tide, all ships rise. Finally, it has to be said that our major competitors aren't really competitors at all and therefore we can get away with what ever we like and there is no viable alternative . Let us know if there is anything else that we can do to screw over you, our loyal customers. Marika P. PokerStars Ass Fucking Team"
Joined: Jul '14
Location: Australia
Age: 29 (M)
Posts: 218
I dunno, using increased liqudity for a solely internet based company seems pretty dodgy for an excuse.
The recent decrease of online gambling in countries that PokerStars has pulled out of has to be a direct cause to the increase in rake and currency conversion charge. It's simple, less players leads to less rake which leads to less income. Any company will look to defend it's profit, and to me this is PokerStars (or whatevercompany owns it now) looking to increase revenue where it has been lost. Additions such as Spin n Go's has increased the presence of recreational players, but they were late to the party. Why Full Tilt introduced them before PokerStars (considering they were owned by the same company) is confusing.
It seems a simple business/economic excuse, less players means an increase in fees to accomodate. PokerStars just handed the customer relations side of this absolutely deplorabley.
Joined: Oct '12
Location: Ukraine
Age: 58 (M)
Posts: 296
Hi, everybody.
YES. I agree to all 100%. FullTilt test platform. And the weakest ideas are fulfilled. Ideas are slightly more strongly tested on a platform of Pokerstars (for example "Week of tasks" . If idea good, it is possible to meet some its modifications.
Joined: May '08
Location: Lithuania
Age: 39 (M)
Posts: 10090
i have no problem with the increased rake and processing fees as long as i am getting more free money from them, if by miracle this is gonna happen- then i can still say that pokerstars is the best place to play poker. there are other places to grind if rake is the main concern (lets be honest- there is no a huge problem to find enough cash games even in the mid liquidity site).
Posted by yout85: A more honest reply would've been:
"Thank you for taking the time to share your concerns with us. In recent weeks, PokerStars has . . . customers. Marika P. PokerStars Ass Fucking Team"
LOL
It's stands to reason, that any company buying another company has plans to improve on the profitability of said company. I think they probably would have taken into account that players were going to be pissed off, and that not enough of them would go elsewhere, to affect policy. It is true that Pokerstars is still cheaper than competitors.
I wonder if they are right about that, or that the sense of injustice, will override rationality? Or that some competitor will rise to the occasion, and be more competitive...
Joined: Feb '14
Location: Portugal
Age: 43 (M)
Posts: 126
Posted by yout85: Purely copied from another forum... which I'll call "Slanted-book" as to not advertise BRMs rivals
This is not a response to me, but I find it interesting still:
"Thank you for taking the time to share your concerns with us. In recent weeks, PokerStars has made several changes which have upset some players. We have heard these complaints and are genuinely listening to the feedback. No one likes higher costs and we appreciate that point of view. In recent years, we have also heard many high-volume, professional poker players say that the games are tougher now and it�s harder to win than in the past. This is one of the reasons we have actually reduced rake, which helps the ROI of these players. But that�s not making the games any softer, which is what would really improve ROI. Instead, we need to invest in new ways to improve the poker economy. Over recent years, we have been developing ways to grow that we believe will attract new players and reactivate players already in our database. Such initiatives include new poker variants, expansion into other gaming verticals, and new marketing approaches. While we understand that not all players are satisfied with the short-term impact of these changes, the reality is they have the potential to increase poker liquidity. However, initiatives to attract players require significant investments in areas of marketing, promotions and product innovation. Additionally, in order to not only secure our continued place as an industry leader across the globe but also to grow ourselves and the game globally, we continue to lobby for the regulation of online poker and attempt to obtain licenses in many newly regulated, locally licensed jurisdictions. We support regulation because we believe it ensures game integrity, player protection, and increases the recognized legitimacy for the game itself. However, there are obviously significant upfront costs to these efforts as well as ongoing costs in the form of gaming license fees and duties. The funding has to come from many places and it is perfectly reasonable that some of it comes from reducing certain costs, which was the rationale for some of the changes to our VIP program, stemming from a review we began early this year, as well as charging a margin on currency exchange fees. It is also the rationale for our changes to the rake. If we can grow poker, everyone will benefit. Even our competitors will benefit, because in a rising tide, all ships rise. Finally, it has to be said that our rake, our currency exchange rates and our VIP program are all more competitive than those of our major competitors. Let us know if there is anything else that we can help you with. Marika P. PokerStars Support Team"
Here's what I take from this:
"Dear customer,
Forget all the b******t that the previous owners believed, we bought this s**t and now we´re going to turn it in to a casino so we can f**k you in the ass two times harder than before. If you don't like it you can always go f**k yourself."
Joined: Mar '12
Location: United Kingdom
Age: 45 (F)
Posts: 2261
Nice post yout. There does seem to be more complaining about stars recently but maybe they should look at Tesco in the UK.A monopoly on supermarkets and the biggest customer numbers night be profitable in the short term but it doesn't take long for people to start jumping ship when they feel they are being taken for suckers.
Joined: Mar '09
Location: Greece
Age: 47 (F)
Posts: 14136
So. you were expecting them to say : Yes we did that to earn more money, after all its our pockets we care not yours...... Silly response And one of the most funny things in it, was that they were so kind, that they even thought how much their changes will benefit their competitors
Joined: Oct '14
Location: Serbia
Age: 34 (M)
Posts: 4358
we will see what would it be soon... Will players masively leave pokerstars ( I doubt it ) but it is possibility. If they do leave, they will be forced to change back rakes. If players dont leave then they will make a lot of money and that is it...
Joined: Apr '09
Location: Australia
Age: 40 (M)
Posts: 6483
Hehehe, nice one yout85
Posted by yout85: ... Such initiatives include new poker variants (casino games), expansion into other gaming verticals (casino games), and new marketing approaches (advertising casino games)....
Joined: May '08
Location: Canada
Age: 48 (M)
Posts: 1017
I as I once said before,I'll say it again,since we all know that pokerstars and fulltilt were recently sold,there are new owners calling the shots,these people have spent billions of there dollars,(most from investors money).Now they must of been promised some kind of sweet deal too invest with very good returns.
Since they have been sold all we have seen from the big 2 are new charges or changes,too charge us more for the the opportunity to play the big 2. THEY NEED too make that money back quick and like as promised,so how do you do that? changes things ,say that there is more money too be made,with the least cost,too then,but at a price for us players.....My thoughts.
its all about the hard $ This is talking like its nice wheater outside, but its raining and there is storm... Listen people 5$ is the same as 10$ bla bla bla bla You can fool youre self amaya but not the costumer
Joined: Feb '11
Location: Germany
Age: 31 (M)
Posts: 1859
Their text is kinda b******t, however I can understand a small cut for the players. Amaya bought a company of an industy that's through its peak, Obviously that money has to be earned again. I simply think they've cut at the wrong spots. Also don't forget amaya one bought them to get back into the american market. This surely won't be cheap either, but would indeed help the poker economy
Edited by BeMyATMplz (02 November 2014 @ 10:39 GMT)
. If idea good, it is possible to meet some its modifications.
LOL
