On Wednesday, ex-Full Tilt Poker owner Howard Lederer released a statement via Daniel Negreanus's blog on Black Friday (April 15, 2011) when Full Tilt Poker (along with another 2 major poker sites) was closed down by the United States Department of Justice and thousands of players couldn't withdraw their funds for years to come. Negreanu's blog post in red and Lederers statement in black.
S[...] Read more » Howard Lederer's Apology To The Poker Community
Joined: Nov '12
Location: Canada
Age: 55 (M)
Posts: 4675
G'day mates
I think this apology is "too little, way to damned late". Howard Lederer lied to players and took advantage of peoples trust. When "Black Friday" happened I was living in the United States. I was totally screwed over because of it. I lost my only avenue to play poker because I suddenly was unable to play online. He hardly was even punished for his part in what happened. Why you ask? Because he had enough money to buy his way out of it from a legal point of view in the US. If a poor person had lied to and defrauded people the way he did they would have went to prison. Howard spent money on a great legal team and just bought his way out.
Joined: Jun '13
Location: Canada
Age: 80 (M)
Posts: 3700
Ronin you were directly hurt by the Black Friday and i understand your frustration. I was not a customer of Full Tilt and did not suffered directly of this. Know is he saying the truth nobody know he is the only one to know exactly what happened . I am not saying that i believe it but i like very much the comment of Daniel Negreanu.
I read his blog a few time and fid that he is a very bright guy and his comment are all interesting.
I believe they are both Puppets for Stars and should not be believed. They are both very smart and as such, it would be foolish to believe HL got 40mil and did not know exactly what was going on...he's is and always will be liar a cheat....
Joined: Jun '13
Location: Canada
Age: 80 (M)
Posts: 3700
Posted by ChopperDave: I believe they are both Puppets for Stars and should not be believed. They are both very smart and as such, it would be foolish to believe HL got 40mil and did not know exactly what was going on...he's is and always will be liar a cheat....
You really think that Daniel care about Stars.
For sure he is getting money from them but go read his blog and when Stars does something he does not like he say it and don't care.
He does not need them anymore with the money he have he could live without working no problem.
Joined: May '08
Location: Lithuania
Age: 39 (M)
Posts: 10090
i have to admit that once i saw the text of this story spread out on more than two paragraphs i was immediately hooked onto NOT reading it, therefore i can only add that i don't really give a sh1t on whether this dude is apologising or not and whether it's sincere or not. keep it shorter, pochui's brain is boiling when he tries to read anything too long
Joined: Mar '11
Location: United Kingdom
Age: 55 (M)
Posts: 7371
This apology is way too little. Lots of people lost money over this or had to wait an awful long time to get any money back. It seems he has got away with this and he should be thoroughly ashamed of himself but i doubt it
Joined: May '08
Location: Germany
Age: 59 (M)
Posts: 6786
As other said before, this is just to little, to late. 5 years have passed since the blow up of the original FT, and now this half harted attempt of an excuse by Lederer. I guess not to many players will buy that.
Joined: Jan '09
Location: Italy
Age: 53 (M)
Posts: 3871
Posted by RoninHarper: G'day mates
I think this apology is "too little, way to damned late". Howard Lederer lied to players and took advantage of peoples trust. When "Black Friday" happened I was living in the United States. I was totally screwed over because of it. I lost my only avenue to play poker because I suddenly was unable to play online. He hardly was even punished for his part in what happened. Why you ask? Because he had enough money to buy his way out of it from a legal point of view in the US. If a poor person had lied to and defrauded people the way he did they would have went to prison. Howard spent money on a great legal team and just bought his way out.
Apology not accepted Howard!
Completely on your side about this buffoonery Ronin
Howard Lederer just thinks "What am I gonna do when I'm 80 years old like Doyle"? He was on his way to be a poker legend untill that happened.
If it was really like he said, all mismanagement and greedy people (he chose them though) running the company, then I could actually forgive him... But I don't buy into that crap without proof that he wasn't aware of any illegal activities... and I doubt he has proof of that.
Joined: Jun '13
Location: Canada
Age: 80 (M)
Posts: 3700
We have seen many companies going bankrupt due to poor management after having building a very profitable one they did exactly what Lederer said i did.
Is it true like Daniel Negreanu said it is to everyone to decide.
And i like very much Daniel comment when he say i would not care sitting at the same poker table but he will never be my friend.
Oh this got away with this fraud in the millions then laughs at all the Full Tilt players 5 years later with this lame apology a big piece of S**T scum of the earth you want to flush down the toilet.
We as online poker players whatever the stakes we play, our life was nice until that black friday. The guy can't come out of his cave like that to apology... I think he is part of the illegal activities full stop. I'm not a victim of BF but Its unacceptable...
Joined: Feb '13
Location: United Kingdom
Age: 47 (F)
Posts: 2372
You will all hate me for saying this but...
It was absolutely common knowledge that it was illegal in the US to put money into poker sites and that the sites circumvented the law illegally. And it is also well known that back then there wasn't the protection of money in place like there is today (and protection is pretty poor, even today.)
Not only was this situation predictable, but with the way the US was talking about reclaiming money and taxes etc etc, it was entirely expected.
You (as did I) took a risk, we all knew it was a risk. But now, well it is just easier in today's society to blame someone else, isn't it?
We all did something knowing we could lose all our bankroll, and then get all disgusted when that very thing happens.
Joined: Feb '11
Location: United Kingdom
Age: 59 (M)
Posts: 5712
Interesting comments guys. However it seems to me that just because it is poker, that some people in charge of the company who appear to have been allegedly negligent in their management and oversight of the company receive little consequence for the inconvenience and losses to, and lack of care shown towards individual customers. Had it been another organisation, then the outcome May have been different. Saying sorry seems to make Mr Leferer better, but not anyone else!
also I saw on an other site that probably he is apologizing because it appears that he wants to play this year's WSOP... so if its the case its a bullsh1t apology then.
Full Tilt are really guilty that they worked illegally, as well as other websites. They think knew what so will occur, but wanted to undertake nothing or just refused to them as a lot of money has been laundered in the illegal way.
Joined: Aug '10
Location: Germany
Age: 52 (M)
Posts: 2219
Thats true, but i think the real owner behind the public are the real bad guys, not poker pros like Lederer, Ivey and so on. Ok Lederer hold share on ft in the past, but i´m sure that didn´t knew all things. But ok, thank you to poker stars that we got our money later
Joined: Oct '08
Location: Germany
Age: 49 (M)
Posts: 2025
Posted by IceQueenAce: You will all hate me for saying this but...
It was absolutely common knowledge that it was illegal in the US to put money into poker sites and that the sites circumvented the law illegally. And it is also well known that back then there wasn't the protection of money in place like there is today (and protection is pretty poor, even today.)
Not only was this situation predictable, but with the way the US was talking about reclaiming money and taxes etc etc, it was entirely expected.
You (as did I) took a risk, we all knew it was a risk. But now, well it is just easier in today's society to blame someone else, isn't it?
We all did something knowing we could lose all our bankroll, and then get all disgusted when that very thing happens.
well, many things on earth are on the boarder of legality. i doubt that the majority knew what was going on and if its legal or not. most pokerplayer are still occasion player and rarely read whats going on behind the scene. it was after PS the biggest pokersite with a dozen known pros, WSOP winners and whatever promoting the site - that alone gives someone a safety feeling, to have his money on the right place. surely there were alot others involved but he was the face of FT, so its normal that everyone blames him. i just cant believe someone whos leading (or one of the leader) a big company and tells me he didnt know over all the years whats going on. he gotta be dumb, but a dumb person isnt even capable to launch a company.
billy boy: i did not have sexual relation with that woman
