Joined: Nov '10
Location: Serbia
Age: 37 (M)
Posts: 2087
I just find pretty good video by Daniel about stop and go strategy. It is very good explained and if someone of you guys are not familiar with it you should watch this video since that is really good strategy for tournaments!
Joined: Feb '08
Location: Netherlands
Age: 52 (M)
Posts: 818
Nice vid, Jovicakralj. Haven't seen this video before, but i have used this strategy. I discussed many strategies with a good friend of mine and play's like this have come up. Maybe not as well-explained as Daniel, but same theorie, same analization. Good vid though, there a lot of these little in-play strategies, maybe we shoud start a thread about strategies like this
Joined: Mar '11
Location: Romania
Age: 45 (M)
Posts: 43
Playin stop'n'go would only apply to buy-in tournaments, where people actually invested money to play. Stop'n'go failed me too many times in freerolls and also has no value for me when playing cash micros or re-buy micro tournaments.
this is the play safe strategy playing like this never wins you a tourney, simple.. i dont like this strategy. il rather ship it in with my ace queen and if he calls so what, chance of a double up or they might respect your raise and fold, anyway i rather take my chances heads up with ace q vs k 10 for a double up, but only if i had that amount of chips
do not play this strategy imo.... in the long run you will win more by pushing all in......
Joined: Feb '10
Location: Finland
Age: 38 (M)
Posts: 1248
When making a call with only 8bb preflop, its a must to go all in no matter what flop brings. Imo when having such a small stack, it really does not matter if you stop and go or just go.
Joined: Dec '09
Location: United Kingdom
Age: 42 (M)
Posts: 2087
Posted by Kristan: When making a call with only 8bb preflop, its a must to go all in no matter what flop brings. Imo when having such a small stack, it really does not matter if you stop and go or just go.
its a good point but people and to often will call a short stack with a wide range and if i hit the 2 on the flop i may just call because this strategy is so clear what hes doing, dont get me wrong i still use it from time to time infact used it about an hour ago with AQ like in the video and flop came 982 i went all in he called with 4s
Joined: Nov '10
Location: Serbia
Age: 37 (M)
Posts: 2087
@Dozn: You are wrong mate! This is not "safe" playing... If you have already made your mind to go all in I think it would be more clever sometimes to wait for flop before putting all chips in. I dont see how its "safe" when you gonna ship it no matter what flop is. This way you have bigger fold equity... @Flippedchips: Exactly!
Joined: Oct '09
Location: Lithuania
Age: 33 (F)
Posts: 1180
Thanks for sharing :} I can say that it is my first time i see this video but I usually make 50%all in 50% call in situation like this as I can see I need to call, ok I will do it next time more often :}
Joined: Oct '10
Location: Romania
Age: 36 (M)
Posts: 178
I think some guys didn''t understand. This is explained in detail in Collin Moshman's book SNG strategy. It only applies when : 1.You want to go allin with your hand but 2. Your reraise is too small to make your opponent to fold. For ex. you got 3200 and you are raised for 2000.
If you would just go with the hand, you and your opponent have to show the hands and go to showdown but if you stop and go you buy yourself onefree bluff chance that might get the opponent to fold. After all if he's got a small pair (the example Negreanu mentioned) and he sees a K high board he'll think you are just a donk who has no idea about push/fold strategy and luckily hit his King. Ife he calls, that's it, the same result would've happened if you pushed yourself in the first place.
3. This may only succeed versus thinking bluffable players like TAGs or tight-passive, not maniacs or calling stations.
Joined: Jan '11
Location: United States
Age: 60 (M)
Posts: 3361
Like your explanation / analysis! Being new to most of this I read everyone's replies and points. Wish I knew enough to make my own analysis, but I just shut up and absorb at this time. Enjoyed all the vid clips this morning and wish you all luck at the tables!
Posted by jovicakralj: @Dozn: You are wrong mate! This is not "safe" playing... If you have already made your mind to go all in I think it would be more clever sometimes to wait for flop before putting all chips in. I dont see how its "safe" when you gonna ship it no matter what flop is. This way you have bigger fold equity... @Flippedchips: Exactly!
what if the flop comes kkk, you still gonna shove???? no your not so it is safe play then init.... you have a choice to fold scary flop for you................. your low on chips, you do really want a caller with ace q, if you shove pre flop... just raise all in and there a chance to steal his blinds there and then, insteed of flat calling seeing a flop and then shoving,
given your low on chips and want to win the tourney better to just push all in to try and steal the blinds,, insteed of seeing a flop then trying to stealing them, you want to win the tourney and to do this you want a coin flip, you need to double up, as for flat calling your not risking your hole stack yet by raising your just calling , thats what i ment by safe play then your gonna shove it on the flop, no matter what now thats just fooking reckless , shhit like this is bad strategy imo,
but hey every1 plays different and has different tactics
Joined: Nov '10
Location: Serbia
Age: 37 (M)
Posts: 2087
Dozn, I think you dont understand this. This strategy is only for situation when you are serious short stack and you have already made your mind to go all in. If player who has attacked your bb have big stack he will call your hand for sure! So if you have losing hand you will lose but if you call pf and shove after flop (no matter what flop is) you will have some fold equity! If you get called with better hand and lose..well..you would be called anyway preflop and you would lost also! So you can only win with this type of play! And this is only good if you are sure that you will do all in no matter what flop is! If flop is KKK well that might be good for you since there is chance that he will call you with any ace or if he have suited connectors he wont call you since he hoped from start to hit flop! Off course since you are very short stacked he would call you for sure before flop so...
Joined: Feb '11
Location: Canada
Age: 39 (M)
Posts: 1660
I like this strategy, it makes sense to me. Especially seeing as the closer you are to the money the less risky people want to be. Good mathematical explanation as well.
