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BankrollMob Forum » Hand Histories » QQ UTG - KK flop

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  6-Apr-11, 09:06   #1
QQ UTG - KK flop 0 
jbrooksie 

Joined: Oct '10
Location: United Kingdom
Age: 58 (M)
Posts: 442
Was it wrong to check then fold to the flop bet from BTN?

Bodog - $3.00+$0.30|<> NL - Holdem - 10 players
Hand converted by PokerTracker 3

CO: 1,620.00
BTN: 1,400.00
SB: 1,440.00
BB: 1,550.00
Hero (UTG): 1,500.00
UTG+1: 1,640.00
MP: 1,650.00
MP+1: 1,490.00
MP+2: 640.00
LP: 2,070.00

SB posts SB 15.00, BB posts BB 30.00

Pre Flop: (45.00) Hero has Q Heart Q Club

Hero raises to 120.00, UTG+1 calls 120.00, fold, fold, fold, fold, CO calls 120.00, BTN calls 120.00, fold, fold

Flop: (525.00, 4 players) K Heart K Club 5 Heart
Hero checks, UTG+1 checks, CO checks, BTN bets 210.00, fold, fold, fold

BTN wins 525.00

     
  6-Apr-11, 09:21   #2
  0 
BeMyATMplz 
Joined: Feb '11
Location: Germany
Age: 26 (M)
Posts: 1859
The flop is a good flop to know where you stand,but you won't be sure if you dont bet..
Bet ~ 1/2 pot (250 seems reasonable) and fold to a raise.

     
  6-Apr-11, 09:22   #3
  0 
shokaku 

Joined: May '08
Location: Germany
Age: 54 (M)
Posts: 6692
If we were deeper bet/fold would be the best play. But with that low stacks we can't fold if we put more chips in the middle. And we are out of position too, and in danger to stack ourselfe.

     
  6-Apr-11, 09:23   #4
  0 
BeMyATMplz 
Joined: Feb '11
Location: Germany
Age: 26 (M)
Posts: 1859
Posted by shokaku:
If we were deeper bet/fold would be the best play. But with that low stacks we can't fold if we put more chips in the middle. And we are out of position too, and in danger to stack ourselfe.


Why wouldn't he be able to fold to a raise?He only put about 1/4 of his stack in with that play,there is def. room for folding.

     
  6-Apr-11, 09:27   #5
  0 
shokaku 

Joined: May '08
Location: Germany
Age: 54 (M)
Posts: 6692
Posted by BeMyATMplz:
Why wouldn't he be able to fold to a raise?He only put about 1/4 of his stack in with that play,there is def. room for folding.

More 1/3 of the stack. We would end up being the smallest stack at the table.

And anyone who just flat calls can outplay us on later streets.

     
  6-Apr-11, 09:38   #6
  0 
BeMyATMplz 
Joined: Feb '11
Location: Germany
Age: 26 (M)
Posts: 1859
On a flop like that you dont need to bet pot or anything to know in what shape you are,he can do a small bet of 200-250,players on bodog will just raise pot if they have the K,smaller pockets and 4's will flat and check down unless they improve...

     
  6-Apr-11, 09:45   #7
  0 
Flippedchips 

Joined: Dec '09
Location: United Kingdom
Age: 38 (M)
Posts: 2087
thats a tricky one with so many in the pot one could easy have a K but could also easy have a draw or under pair from your Qs and decided to rep the K. folding here is prob not so bad its early in the tourney and plenty time but you could call see what he does if a heart comes or something depends alot on your feeling at the time this kinda of thing. i dont think being down to say 1000 is a big deal here shokaku tbh, the bb is 30 you still have loads of bbs. i see people get all stressed over this all the time and ship the chips in with crap and then say they were short stacked its nothing of the kind there is plenty of time left

     
  6-Apr-11, 09:54   #8
  0 
ZmxPowah 
Joined: Nov '09
Location: Poland
Age: 30 (M)
Posts: 1189
Multiwaypot + we don't have position.
He can only c/f or c/c not big bet here on the flop.

     
  6-Apr-11, 10:20   #9
  0 
jessthehuman 

Joined: Apr '09
Location: Australia
Age: 35 (M)
Posts: 6482
lately in $10-$30 buyin MTT (don't do this in cash/ring) I've found just open shoving QQ from UTG seems to reap pretty good results, I get called by worse a LOT more than better. People don't know what to think of it and get upset and call 1010/JJ/AJ/AQ/etc - so far I've found this to be a fairly good fix for playing QQ UTG.

     
  6-Apr-11, 10:56   #10
  0 
jbrooksie 

Joined: Oct '10
Location: United Kingdom
Age: 58 (M)
Posts: 442
Thanks all for your comments, seems that I should at least have bet on the flop if only to see where I stood.

     
  6-Apr-11, 11:29   #11
  0 
Hajinnho 

Joined: Jan '10
Location: Germany
Age: 28 (M)
Posts: 1379
not so sure. Well i am really often contibetting but in that case i am not quite sure if it really is necessary. You have so many opponents and the limit is micro (or at least low). That means preflop you have all the KQ, KJ, Kxs caller so it is quite normal that anybody would have hit the Kings. You could have give it a try and maybe you take the pot down right there, but maybe you are just betting dead money here

     
  6-Apr-11, 12:07   #12
  0 
dozn01 

Joined: Sep '09
Location: United Kingdom
Age: 40 (M)
Posts: 5000
this is why i love poker,
different situations...........you played that hand the best way you know.................
i my self would of played it different, but there a few factors to take note,
thats why i really never answer question like this in the forum ,
how was the table playing were there calling machines,
were the player who you were against aggressive, were there always in many pots ,
the answer to your question has so many different answers to,
how well did you know your opponent,?
obviously you think you have played the hand wrong because your postsing this,
but the right way of play would of to bet the flop to see were you were in the hand,
me my self am a agressive player but if i checked the flop and he bet the turn,
i might of repoped him back and put pressure back on them,
but thats playing the player, if they were a tight a player and push obviously il fold,
thats why nobody can answer this question right,
you have to be there in that situations,
knowing what been going on the table from the start of the game,


     
  6-Apr-11, 12:38   #13
  0 
Killuminated 

Joined: Mar '11
Location: United States
Age: 37 (M)
Posts: 178
I think a continuation bet would of been better at the flop. Checking through it gave the btn the impression that you didn't hit your hand. This would of been a good place to bluff for both you and btn, even though your bluff would of been a semi-bluff.

But since you didnt bet at the flop, you probably should of called.

And i would of just dumped these cards or limped, their too dangerous to play utg and your just asking for trouble.


     
  6-Apr-11, 13:49   #14
  0 
Fackinas 
Joined: Oct '09
Location: Lithuania
Age: 28 (F)
Posts: 1180
Nice flop I think it would be worse if flop would be K 5 6 or something like this .. Now it is less chance that someone will have King and u have bigger chances of wining the hand !!!!!!!!!! I think so .. So cbet is good here and check/fold no good at all

     
  6-Apr-11, 14:31   #15
  0 
theratcat 
Joined: Feb '11
Location: United States
Age: 47 (M)
Posts: 51
Posted by jbrooksie:

Hand converted by PokerTracker 3




Hows the cheat software working out and do you use it on PS or FTP ?

     
  6-Apr-11, 14:39   #16
  0 
Fakiry 

Joined: Apr '09
Location: Portugal
Age: 40 (M)
Posts: 4815
I think i would have made a bet on the flop, perhaps half pot too. I know that pairs at the flop are the worst when they don't combine with our hand, but eventhough you should have made a bet. This way he probably robbed you laughing out loud, thinking you had a small pair, which you didn't. He could have had just an Ace and do that movement.


     
  6-Apr-11, 15:40   #17
  0 
theratcat 
Joined: Feb '11
Location: United States
Age: 47 (M)
Posts: 51

Is a tough spot, if you had checked the turn to me I probably would of bet also but a pot sized bet, even with air.
I think you made the right decision to fold and wait for a better spot where you know your in the lead or better position.

What did the cheater software say about his play ?

     
  6-Apr-11, 16:02   #18
  0 
andy5521 
Joined: Jul '08
Location: United Kingdom
Age: 30 (M)
Posts: 89
You should of raised a bit more i think to push more people out in the first place but if that guy bet into you he probably has a K so folding would be right here i think, if you shoved and he had a K you would look stupid.

     
  6-Apr-11, 19:35   #19
  0 
B1gfoot 

Joined: Mar '08
Location: United Kingdom
Age: 40 (M)
Posts: 6714
I expect to be well ahead, first id of bet the flop and fold if he goes over the top, f he calls im probably check folding.
However as said I expect to be ahead haer and belive if button is on set its a weak one and id be happy to put my SnG at risk and go all in, some thing like 70/30 to you here.
As you bet out UTG you should expect a little respect..
That said its eairly, so no real harm in folding.
You have 2 choices after he made a bet IMO fold or AI.

     
  6-Apr-11, 20:37   #20
  0 
jbrooksie 

Joined: Oct '10
Location: United Kingdom
Age: 58 (M)
Posts: 442
Posted by theratcat:
Posted by jbrooksie:

Hand converted by PokerTracker 3




Hows the cheat software working out and do you use it on PS or FTP ?


I don't use the HUD yet, find it too confusing and distracting. It's excellent for reviewing hands though and, of course, accurately recording my losses Big Smile

I use it on Bodog and PS.

------------
Posted by theratcat:


What did the cheater software say about his play ?


I don't use the HUD, besides which this was the start of the second level of blinds (or close to it) so there wouldn't have been much to go on anyway.

Edited by jbrooksie (06 April 2011 @ 20:43 GMT)


     
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