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Joined: Feb '11
Location: Portugal
Age: 32 (M)
Posts: 56
This week, another study was published to prove something we already know players and try to show a long time - that poker is a game of skill.
This time, the author of the study is the economist Steven Levitt, who became famous after publishing the book Freakonomics: The Hidden Side of Everything Unexpected And that affects us.
To this end, Levitt and his co-author Thomas Miles, analyzed statistics from the World Series of Poker 2010, which had more than 30,000 players in its 57 events, totaling $ 185 million in cash prizes.
The study concluded that skilled players had won 30% of their investments, while the other players missed 15%, as the introduction of the article:
"In determining the legality of online poker - a multibillion dollar industry - the courts are based on the question of whether or not poker is a game of skill. Using newly available data, we analyzed this question by examining the performance of a group of players in the WSOP 2010, identified before the beginning of the events as highly skilled. These players reached an average investment return of 30%, compared with a loss of 15% of all other players. The big difference is strong evidence showing that poker is a game of skill. "
Joined: May '09
Location: India
Age: 37 (M)
Posts: 4873
nice study puts forward some interesting stats. but dont think much will change as this is not the first one to show poker is a skill, many people and authorities who dont want to admit poker is a skill will just ignore it like the others. but hope things change in future
Joined: Feb '08
Location: Netherlands
Age: 52 (M)
Posts: 818
Nice post, interesting to see those percentages but i also don't think that stats from one tournement wil change the mind of those who need to be convinced. I hope more (and other) study's will proof that what we all(?) know: Poker is a game largely based on skill!!!
Joined: Apr '09
Location: Portugal
Age: 44 (M)
Posts: 4827
It has both of it. All card games have rules and you need to know how to play in order to try and win them. If you play well, you can win better, but, if you don't know very well how to play, you can always expect luck to come on your side, which means that even playing bad you can win. Ex: "First time playing texas hold'em poker. Whats a bet? oh, we have to see the cards and the one who have the best combination of 5 cards wins? Ok, than, put them there. Oh, you bet more and i have to put the same amount of chips? ok then, here you have my chips, now show the cards to see if i won. Even more chips? ok, take them. Look, i won, i have a... what name you give to all the cards from the same naipe from Ace to Ten? Nice game". This can always happen...
Joined: Apr '11
Location: Romania
Age: 35 (M)
Posts: 6669
Thats really great that there are a lot of studies that say what we all know. Many have such a bad impression about poker. Of course one thing is common to all these people, they all think poker is just a gambling games that consist 100% on having good luck. Even worse all these people doesn't even know how to play poker and here i'm talking about simple rules not poker strategy. Even if they learn the rules and lose they blame it all on bad luck if they play live and on poker platforms if they play online. The things are pretty simple, can an amatuer beat a poker pro in a match, well of course if it has tons of luck but on long term that player will lose and the pro will have a nice profit graph. That being said i thing on short term luck counts a lot in a poker game(i mean a session here) but over a longer period of time it's the skill that places you apart from the fish players and making you a good and profitable player.
Joined: May '11
Location: Denmark
Age: 36 (M)
Posts: 2
Poker is obviously a skill game. Like backgammon is a skill game. In EVERY game there is luck involved. Some more than other. Saying poker is pure luck is the same as saying football is.
Joined: Mar '11
Location: Croatia
Age: 43 (M)
Posts: 1738
No question about it even without that scientific study that poker is indeed a game of skill, unfortunately, when it comes to free-rolls i have to say luck is the only factor involved in this card game.
Joined: Nov '10
Location: Serbia
Age: 37 (M)
Posts: 2087
Posted by Flagnoli: Poker is obviously a skill game. Like backgammon is a skill game. In EVERY game there is luck involved. Some more than other. Saying poker is pure luck is the same as saying football is.
Exactly! I think just the same! How many times did you seen that best team in some sport loses against some bad team? Just look at sport results... If it is all skill then Barsa would win every football game, Miami every basketball game... BUT they will win most of it just like good player will win more then lose in long term against worse player! LIFE IS GAME OF SKILL AND LUCK TOO!!!
One of the first things I was taught when I first started playing was from a friend who played alot. He told me to always be mindfull that this game is cyclic. Meaning if I was out of sync with the board to wait until the cycle comes around to me again. I've used this advice often and wound up cashing more and bubbling less. On many occasions I would wind up in the cash zone short stacked and hit the cycle which vauled me up the standings. Sometimes even hitting the final table! Skill, patience, and luck in terms of winning the pots I enter, meaning the suk outters don't hit.
------------ And its works at a final table of a $2 BI freeze out...short stacked and no cards lol
Joined: Oct '09
Location: United Kingdom
Age: 57 (M)
Posts: 667
Hi Reiiz
I have to agree with those who say it is mostly skill but a biot of luck is needed to win tournaments with 7500 + entrants. The authorities who wont believe it is at all skill based are those who realise that you cannot "tax" skill?
Joined: Jan '11
Location: Romania
Age: 32 (M)
Posts: 167
Poker is skill but i think that is necessary almoust i little of luck to win a big tourny, expecially during the coin flip. I have the same opinion, anyway luck is part of game.
Joined: Nov '09
Location: Canada
Age: 55 (M)
Posts: 2387
Posted by rbdflyboy: One of the first things I was taught when I first started playing was from a friend who played alot. He told me to always be mindfull that this game is cyclic. Meaning if I was out of sync with the board to wait until the cycle comes around to me again. I've used this advice often and wound up cashing more and bubbling less. On many occasions I would wind up in the cash zone short stacked and hit the cycle which vauled me up the standings. Sometimes even hitting the final table! Skill, patience, and luck in terms of winning the pots I enter, meaning the suk outters don't hit.
------------ And its works at a final table of a $2 BI freeze out...short stacked and no cards lol
A few people will dispute this but to a certain degree I agree. In general you want to play good cards as well as take advantage of certain edges like position, but when you are "cold" be careful, and when you are 'hot" lookout! And when you see someone at the table who is on fire be very careful of tangling with him.
One time at NL100 full ring a guy opposite of my was being very aggressive and hitting with everything when there actually was a showdown. I waited patiently for the killer hand and got it - AA in the pocket with him on the button. Limped in, he naturally raised and I pushed a healthy reraise, he shoved and I called. He had something like KJ and he hit two pairs!
