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   +1   
WoW just bury your head in the sand. FACTS thats all we are looking at FACTS.

FACT is site deal manipulation is allowed FACT. FACT fact is no site tests for reflection of an unbias deal FACT.
FACT Fact is there are more bad beats than you ever see live(and dont give me theres more deals) Im talking percentages.

FACT I CHALLANGE ANYONE TO WATCH A GIVEN GAME AND WE CAN ALL MONITOR A FEW THINGS AT A GIVEN TIME.

SHALL WE GATHER SOME FACTS GUYS OR DO WANA KEEP THAT HEAD IN THE SAND


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I played pro for 3 years, Your name fits well Big Smile

     
   -2   
Posted by onlinejoke:
You miss the point as well ??? heads up aa vs kk is about 5,000/1 and what i want to know is why does this happen more than 1 in 5000 hands.


(I realise btw you have said HU- however I am pretty sure you are also counting all the short-handed and full ring games you play if you truly believe it's happening more often than it should)

Well - since you wanted to talk about facts. It may interest you to know (and this IS a FACT as you like to shout FACT FACT FACT - THIS IS A CAPS-LOCK SCIENCE FACT !)

The chances of facing AA when you hold KK in a full ring table (9 seater) is actually roughly 25:1

That means on in every 25 times you are dealt KK at a full ring game, someone else will wake up with AA.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Poker_probability_%28Texas...

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Posted by onlinejoke:
Your name fits well Big Smile

Yours ? Indeed.

Seriously dude, writing all your posts in CAPS LOCK gives you basically zero credibility. It just makes you sound like a little kid.

I am talking about facts. And the fact is if you pulled your head out of your ass and stopped making up lies and actually put in the work to gather the empirical data then you would actually have facts. However - the reality is you're a lazy s**t and you're just talking total BS and you are completely unwilling to actually invest the time to gather the sample HH required to come to the conclusions you are so happy to state as fact without ever actually testing your hypothesis.

You're a (online)joke.

Edited by jessthehuman (20 May 2011 @ 09:32 GMT)


     
   0   
OK jes come on factswhy are online poker sites allowed to manipulate the deals and why do none of them test for reflection of a real deal WELL.

TRY THIS SIMPLE TEST FFS 3 IN TEN HAND S HEADS UP SHOULD BE WON BY A HIGH CARD NOW STFU AND TRY IT JESS

     
   -1   
Posted by onlinejoke:
OK jes come on factswhy are online poker sites allowed to manipulate the deals and why do none of them test for reflection of a real deal WELL.

TRY THIS SIMPLE TEST FFS 3 IN TEN HAND S HEADS UP SHOULD BE WON BY A HIGH CARD NOW STFU AND TRY IT JESS


stop typing in caps. It makes you look seriously dumb. I have already stated (please actually read my posts before replying) I regularly play HU lotteries - meaning I see HU flips all the time. And it does not back up what you are saying. (They get won by high card often enough, believe me)

Like I said - gather actual data (sample HH) and analyse that and stop making stuff up.

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FWIW:

http://www.bankrollmob.com/forum.asp?mode=thread&id...

Read that. This is an actual intelligible post regarding most of what you rigtards are on about. It is actually quite incredible if you have enough intelligence to get your head around it - and I'm not just being a prick when I say this - but you do actually have to be of at least moderate intelligence to full comprehend/appreciate what is being said there.

It is quite mind-boggling and grounding. And I hope you take the time to read it and actually think about what it means, before you post your next lot of dribble.

Edited by jessthehuman (20 May 2011 @ 09:51 GMT)


     
   +1   
sorry about the caps lock DAD and can I have the stats for HU high card winning hands

Now I read the link and lots of words and thats what they were words. Fact facts facts where are the facts. Again I ask why are on line sites allowed within there licence to manipulate the deals. Why do online site avoid any tests that compare there deals to a real deal(honest deal) Why why why. Facts please answer with facts.

You also sound like a forum employee of owner with lots of words and no facts. Didnt you used to say why would these sites risk there reputation when they make so much money????? And havnt they been caught risking there reputation????? Just another fact.

ps
Is your name Bill Rinni he was full of s**t as well

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retard

Edited by onlinejoke (20 May 2011 @ 22:41 GMT)


     
   0   
a real deal? a honest deal? what exactly is that? no 2 ppl shuffle the cards the same and theyre are millions/billions more card hustles out there that can and will cheat the deck..when push comes to shove who really cares if sites are not fair? if they are rigged for certain ppl to win just leave the site go to a new platform til u find the one that is rigged just for u

Edited by arsenej1 (21 May 2011 @ 00:46 GMT)


     
   -1   
Posted by onlinejoke:
retard


You have no idea how much I wish there were such things as online competitive IQ tests...

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Posted by onlinejoke:
Fact facts facts where are the facts.


That sample of data for 100 players was mathematical fact. This is probability theory. And applying a fairly moderate standard deviation to the expectation. That truly was mathematical fact. Beautiful, soul-destroying mathematics.

It went straight over your head, to be honest - I knew it would.

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If you really want to hurt your hurt - read the wikipedia links in my other thread - on standard deviation applied to gaming.

You'll never get it - but hypothetically if you did - that is when (and only then) you would be educated enough to actually start talking on these matters. Until then - you have no idea how funny you are to me.

     
   +1   
Jess you sure are dumb, A theory is an opinion based on inconclusive facts, Good god man get an education.
What we are looking for are tests of the facts.

Further more poker is about having a hand and fishing for a greater hand and the facts i want are from pre flop to river and this is where you will find a massive variance from expected outcome E.G the see saw deal your in front im in front your in front. Now test that and tell me its not rigged

     
   0   
onlinejoke why dont you post the "facts" as you keep calling them to back up your "theory" and stop talking from your ass, and yes you are looking dumb, If you bother to look back you will see how Jess has posted lots of info and stats etc to back his belif in on-line poker not being rigged.
I just looked over some of your posts/replies and can cofirm you do talk a load of bull rocks, good luck with the gaming commision, it might be worth noting that being a good live player does not mean you will be as good on-line and vicaversa.
BTW im not saying poker is or is not rigged, I do belive it can be manipulated, I do my best to do so, but untill you can talk and do so with something to back it up then you have no chance of even testing your "theory" leaving all your "thoughts" as just that.....and thats why a rigged thread should just be locked, nothing is ever going to come of them outher than heated debates, and if the day comes that poker is rigged, we will all find out at the same time.
Thumbs Up for Lock all "rigged poker" threads.

     
   0   
twat just pick a small tourn and calc the odds of heads up wins from the flop onwards the math dont work. Also track HU 3 in ten hands should be won by a high card this also fails. no site tests for expected outcome why. Gaming commission rules allow dealer manipulation why.

Now dont slag me just answer these questions

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jessthehumen You still havnt posted any facts

Edited by onlinejoke (22 May 2011 @ 16:47 GMT)


     
   0   
How big are your sample sizes online joke? You can observe one tourney and expect to get the exact proportions.

Also this is a busy thread and you seem to have a lot of passion in this matter, may I ask what fuels it? I figure it you were just trying to get a rise out of everyone you would've gotten bored, so what's your agenda exactly?

     
   +1   
Hate to rehash this, but this guy has a pretty strong argument. Two specific ones stand out to me: 1. Heads up 3 out of ten hands should be won by the hi card. 2. AA vs KK AA should win. The only counter arguement i've seen is "i make money at online poker" and "your a rigtard". I usually will be right next to the rest of you lambasting a rigtard but he has clearly brought facts that most in this post are unwilling to read... Makes me wonder.

     
   0   
All these rig tards if they don't like the game why don't they go do something else why the Hell are they on a online poker forum preaching to people that don't give two sh*ts what they have to say I got an idea lets just ignore all there post give them thumbs down till its removed and maybe they just give up and go masterbate or smoke some meth or crack and over dose. It really makes no sense to me as to why they are here complaining.


As for the HH up perhaps but is anyone here gonna sit at heads ups games all day shoving hands to see if 3 out of 10 wins with high card i know i'm not gonna maybe one of you can go with play chips and figure it out as for AA vs KK i play tons of live play it happens sometimes you can lose with AA 5-6 times in a row vs a lower pocket pair 4 to 1 is 20 % no?

Edited by timborep (26 May 2011 @ 12:14 GMT)


     
   0   
Posted by Killuminated:
Hate to rehash this, but this guy has a pretty strong argument. Two specific ones stand out to me: 1. Heads up 3 out of ten hands should be won by the hi card. 2. AA vs KK AA should win. The only counter arguement i've seen is "i make money at online poker" and "your a rigtard". I usually will be right next to the rest of you lambasting a rigtard but he has clearly brought facts that most in this post are unwilling to read... Makes me wonder.


lol I don't actually know if you're being sarcastic or not.

just to clarify

"1. Heads up 3 out of ten hands should be won by the hi card. 2. AA vs KK AA should win."

I agree completely and as far as I can tell- this IS what happens ! Which is why I don't get what everyone is on about.

     
   -1   
I have been reading this thread and now want to make a statement or 2. All-in pre to me seems to be a precarious situation no matter if online or brick and mortar. 5 cards are coming that can do a bunch of things to any hole hand. That said, I seem to win more online if I can avoid the push it all pre-flop. If it is pushed live, then you see the cards as they are dealt and there is very little question as to if it is legit. Only not 100% because there are still some out there who have hands just a touch quicker than the eye registers what just happened.

As far as rigged sites goes, there will be people on either side of this until the web implodes on itself and we go back to the dark ages. I have noticed that this issue, if you take the time to look, runs real close along nationality lines. And no ladies and germs, I am not racist against other nationalities, and can only speak on my own experiences. It is all about show me exorbinate amount of hands with those who are on the non-rig side it seems. They have their reasons for being on the side they are onin this discussion.

Now, I have posted this before so hope I don't get any who take issue with me for that, but I have played online at all size sites from the big 3 to smaller networks. It all seems to go about the same way. Brand new accounts will dominate for individual for from a week or so to maybe 3 weeks tops usually. I got the Players Only no deposit bonus from this very site with new account there and for the first 2 and a half weeks had crazy good results. Won a few decent size tourneys and placed at final table in several. layed cash games and can only think of 1 time I lost money at a table. Had that free 50 turned into $1186 and some pennies at the time the fall began.

Let me say that some will say why were you playing those cards when I exlain, but after watching what has happened ver and over and over, I saw what cards were winning hands. A-8 wins tons at Players. QQ get killed lots and JJ does good. Anyways, when the downturn started, I says to myself, "Self, you have seen this scenario before. More than once, self. So, what are you going to do?." What I did was decided to use it as my own little experiment and I got what I was seeking. An account with less than $10 in it. The timing is always pretty close to the same on every site I played on. Just prior to or at the bubble, that is worst of all, to minor cashes for a bit. How is it that I have seen neither side of this mention that the showdowns are almost ALWAYS 2 hands that are too close to each other. My losses strted happening and that $1186 was gone in 4 days and maybe 5 times I was busted in a fashion other than the following. It was always that they had 1 card bigger and the other was matched. I have KQ suited and chose to play it and the Q might make a set. Somebody had AQ. Out. I play donk rags to try change my luck like J7. It makes a hand and the other player has Q7. Out. Strange that the bets make playing the cards seem to be odd. The cards changed, making this a random act, but it is too much coincidence that always the next card over was the killer. This said, we all know the sites don't allow, supposedly, programs that data mine info except within small parameters, right? Question for any who chose to keep reading. What are these sites in essence? One very large data mining program in and of themselves is my opinion. The sites have every hand you have ever played there archived somewhere in their bowels. My assertion is, then, that they know what cards will entice you to play because they have it in their memory banks. Deal those cards to you and you are at their disposal. I was contacted by live support because in a couple tourneys at the kill time, I started asking the table who has such and such in their hand that is fixing to put me out. My 1 card over theory. Actually got quite a few answers. Site questioned me as to how did I know what other players hole cards were, and when I repeated what I have said here, all that was said was I did not need to talk about the cards in the current hands any longer. The program is on a loop so the same hands are dealt over and over with different particular cards in the hands but how is it that on more than 1 site the same thing happened to me and on FT it was 89 of 90 times where I was at risk, I lost the hand even though when the cards were turned up, I was ahead at the time? Hold at risk at showdown 1 time in 90 straight is not very much variance if you ask me. What I have put here is my own personal happenings. I am not claiming to be anywhere close to pro level player. I worded it that way because anyone can claim professional status for tax and other purposes. But I am no noob or fish either. I have won far more than risked in live poker, and a lot can be attributed to luck. But I look forward to seeing what comments this brings, good and otherwise.

Oh yeah, one more tidbit that I noticed on Players was the same couple of people were always at the top of their point system for freeroll tourneys the following month. Either these people were that much above the rest that they were outplaing the whole site. But, they never seem to get the suckout donk beats that 98% of the site gets. Or there were other factors in play.

No matter which side of this you be on, each has a righ to their own opinion. I have live poker less than 1 hour up I-35N right now and the hopes that my state is going to allow it at horse tracks very soon. Texas has realized how much tax money is going to OK and LA finally I think. Then I will have poker 3.2 miles from my home. I will never deposit again at a site and am glad I didn't at Players. When the roll I have left is played out, I will uninstall it just like I did PS, FT, UB, and BetSharks. Have fun whatever y'all do, and, Shuffle Up And Deal!!!

     
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