There are several people on here who fight all who claim deals are rigged there probably paid by the poker industry to keep the smoke screen thick and furious.They say if you lie enough about something you will believe it your self in the end.
Anyway Im a guy who likes hard solid facts so I have listed a few and I welcome the foolish believers to reply but with facts not speeches.
Fact on line gaming commissions allow deal manipulation
Fact poker sites fail to obtain tests of long number probability the only true test of genuine deal
Fact online poker site testing houses carry out no tests to compare with a genuine unbias deal
Fact there is not one shred of evidence to prove an online deal reflects a genuine live deal
Now if on line poker is so honest why would all this go on and why wouldnt at least one site say Hey lets sort this once and for all and do a proper test of long number probability. Math cannot lie
Joined: Feb '08
Location: United Kingdom
Age: 35 (M)
Posts: 1886
As much as I hate arguing about this again and again and again...
Posted by onlinejoke: Fact on line gaming commissions allow deal manipulation
If this is a fact please prove it cos I just looked at the UK gambling commission website, which is a government site and it clearly states that in order to obtain an online gaming license, you must follow the codes of practice under section 24 of the Gambling Act 2005 ensuring that gambling is conducted in a fair and open way.
Posted by onlinejoke: Fact poker sites fail to obtain tests of long number probability the only true test of genuine deal
But they have proven that they have the use of genuine RNG, which have been independently tested and found to be fair. This does not confirm 100% that the entire process is fair but even a huge sample of data from collected hands couldn't do this.
Posted by onlinejoke: Fact online poker site testing houses carry out no tests to compare with a genuine unbias deal
Fact there is not one shred of evidence to prove an online deal reflects a genuine live deal
But why should a genuine live deal be better than an online deal. No one has ever collected any evidence to prove that live dealing is completely unbiased or that all hands play out exactly the same number of times. (it would be bizarre if it did) And of course you can't compare live and online deals cos online players play more hands, play is faster, looser and the number of hands going to showdown is bound to differ.
So you have no facts that make any valid point. And I have no invested interest in online poker. I am not an affiliate or investor. I play for my own enjoyment and am happy to continue playing even if it's -ev in the long run. But I am happy to read genuine arguments about why poker is rigged if anyone can ever provide sensible information. Which no one can. So please please PLEASE everyone stop filling my favourite forum with b******t.
Jess your getting disparate 1 writing fact is fact thats just a basic fact 2 there are no caps lock in my post.
------------ If this is a fact please prove it cos I just looked at the UK gambling commission website, which is a government site and it clearly states that in order to obtain an online gaming license, you must follow the codes of practice under section 24 of the Gambling Act 2005 ensuring that gambling is conducted in a fair and open way. REPLY
Just another fact the UK have not licenced any online gaming sites.
------------ But they have proven that they have the use of genuine RNG, which have been independently tested and found to be fair. This does not confirm 100% that the entire process is fair but even a huge sample of data from collected hands couldn't do this.
REPLY
long number probability is the only proven method of testing and again I say they do not one test to show a reflection of an unbias deal.
I agree the RNG appears fair but the source information it uses is currupt
------------ But why should a genuine live deal be better than an online deal. No one has ever collected any evidence to prove that live dealing is completely unbiased or that all hands play out exactly the same number of times. (it would be bizarre if it did) And of course you can't compare live and online deals cos online players play more hands, play is faster, looser and the number of hands going to showdown is bound to differ.
So you have no facts that make any valid point. And I have no invested interest in online poker. I am not an affiliate or investor. I play for my own enjoyment and am happy to continue playing even if it's -ev in the long run. But I am happy to read genuine arguments about why poker is rigged if anyone can ever provide sensible information. Which no one can. So please please PLEASE everyone stop filling my favourite forum with b******t.
math determines probable outcome in any game or deal. and long number probable testing will reveal all. the amount of hands dealt does not matter as the type of play as probability is probability.
Check out Ipoker network monitor 100 hands HU and see how many players win with a high card. probability says 30 hands should win this way.
Also note that many a bookmaker has made a living for many years using expected outcome in many a horse race.
------------ jessthehuman where are some facts please i have published a few now please do the same
Joined: Feb '08
Location: United Kingdom
Age: 35 (M)
Posts: 1886
But your facts are only facts in your opinion. Jesses point was saying it does not make it true. I could write "fact I have made $1000 dollars from online poker this month" but it wouldn't be true just cos you couldn't prove otherwise. If you want to convince as with facts you need to be more detailed and provide evidence.
And sorry but you are wrong about not providing long number probable testing being the only proof. RNG means that given an infinite number of hands the chances of every card situation are equal and your odds of getting high card, flush, fullhouse etc are exactly as they should be.
But I admit it's possible that poker sites fix their card generator, although they would have no interest in doing this and it would be more complicated, so to test the situation in real play you'd have to collect a sample of real dealt hands. But this could not prove that online poker is fair for several reasons
river cards are only revealed if you get to that stage the skill level of players effects the statistics of showdown cards probability is probability and cannot actually be proven by maths Roll a dice a million times and you will still not get an equal number of each side if the test worked the sites would only have to not fix the cards while the test was carried out or make sure that the numbers balanced ie good hands were dealt to the right people
if i have misunderstood something I apologise but your theory doesn't make sense to me and I have no intention of trying anymore to convince you.
Joined: Apr '09
Location: Portugal
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Posts: 4827
If you understand something of programing software, you know you can created a simpled random answer program with only two possiblities: "yes" and "no" and, although each one has 50% of probabilities of happening, nothing says that, after having a "no" (same as loosing with AA all in pre-flop), you will have a "yes" (winning AA all in pre-flop in the same conditions, position, etc.) in the same room. Probabilities are the same so... its like throwing a coin to see if it is crown or face, and it can result face 20 times in a row. Its possible to happen so, no one can have nothing against that.
Joined: Mar '09
Location: Canada
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Posts: 3207
who cares joke get over it...........rigged or not we all still play and even if it were proved to be true wed still all play. if u dont like online poker then dont play its simple!. maybe this ONLINE poker forum just aint for u
But why should a genuine live deal be better than an online deal. No one has ever collected any evidence to prove that live dealing is completely unbiased or that all hands play out exactly the same number of times. (it would be bizarre if it did) And of course you can't compare live and online deals cos online players play more hands, play is faster, looser and the number of hands going to showdown is bound to differ.
So you have no facts that make any valid point. And I have no invested interest in online poker. I am not an affiliate or investor. I play for my own enjoyment and am happy to continue playing even if it's -ev in the long run. But I am happy to read genuine arguments about why poker is rigged if anyone can ever provide sensible information. Which no one can. So please please PLEASE everyone stop filling my favourite forum with b******t.
math determines probable outcome in any game or deal. and long number probable testing will reveal all. the amount of hands dealt does not matter as the type of play as probability is probability.
Check out Ipoker network monitor 100 hands HU and see how many players win with a high card. probability says 30 hands should win this way.
Also note that many a bookmaker has made a living for many years using expected outcome in many a horse race.
Hi all - I have a "FACT" for all of you.
If you don't like don't do it - I don't believe that anyone is holding a gun to your heads making you play. Or are they?
"NO"
GL to all mobsters wherever you play - believers or not........................
Good point but I love poker and will fight to the end to get an honest deal.
------------ But your facts are only facts in your opinion. Jesses point was saying it does not make it true. I could write "fact I have made $1000 dollars from online poker this month" but it wouldn't be true just cos you couldn't prove otherwise. If you want to convince as with facts you need to be more detailed and provide evidence.
And sorry but you are wrong about not providing long number probable testing being the only proof. RNG means that given an infinite number of hands the chances of every card situation are equal and your odds of getting high card, flush, fullhouse etc are exactly as they should be.
But I admit it's possible that poker sites fix their card generator, although they would have no interest in doing this and it would be more complicated, so to test the situation in real play you'd have to collect a sample of real dealt hands. But this could not prove that online poker is fair for several reasons
river cards are only revealed if you get to that stage the skill level of players effects the statistics of showdown cards probability is probability and cannot actually be proven by maths Roll a dice a million times and you will still not get an equal number of each side if the test worked the sites would only have to not fix the cards while the test was carried out or make sure that the numbers balanced ie good hands were dealt to the right people
if i have misunderstood something I apologise but your theory doesn't make sense to me and I have no intention of trying anymore to convince you.
I cant believe you say long number probability cant prove an honest deal. The entire fabric of out mathematical system says it does. Your points about the RNG are slightly misguided as if the core information is bias then the selection has to be.
Roulette, An RNG it is allowed to select any number but I don't want 8 as this is very bad for the house as my clientèle are chinese. I put in 20 of every number and one number 8. Now I let the totally unbias RNG select a number. This is random as any number can be selected. The RNG is running totally without bias but the games rigged to hell.
If you roll a dice a million times you will within 1% get an equal number thats the whole point of long number probability.
------------ But your facts are only facts in your opinion
A fact is a fact , An opinion is an opinion, A theory is an opinion based on limited facts. Now read my post again and explain why my facts have become opinions
------------ Everyone keeps saying this site???? what site are we talking about I thought this was Bankrollmob who promote a wide range of sites
Joined: Dec '09
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you keep saying 100 hands on i poker for a real test you need way more, why do you try at least 10,000 or 100,000 then maybe you will have something to argue with and show us proof not just turn up and say FACT lol
tbh you just seem like a lonely bitter man to me, so thats me done with your threads as im sure most are bored with you now
Joined: Mar '09
Location: Canada
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Posted by Flippedchips: you keep saying 100 hands on i poker for a real test you need way more, why do you try at least 10,000 or 100,000 then maybe you will have something to argue with and show us proof not just turn up and say FACT lol
tbh you just seem like a lonely bitter man to me, so thats me done with your threads as im sure most are bored with you now
lol bored with this guy? nahhhhhhh that couldnt be? im more interested in the annoying popups i keep getting while catching up on my porn sites then anything this joke got to say
i have decided to hijack all these dumbass threads with some more annoying posts maybe ppl will get annoyed with me and let things be?
maybe i should take an hour and go through some pages and BUMP all decent poker threads back up so we can get ridda all the garbage thats been around latly and back to our poker goals/acomplishments? what u thnk flippedchips?
Joined: Apr '11
Location: Romania
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Posts: 6669
People are free to think what they want really, if you really think online poker is rigged and always the people that win at the table on which you play are bots or people that "work" for the poker platform it's strictly your opinion. In time i learned that it's useless to convience people that you can actually have fun and win money online. If they have succes on live poker it's really okay, there are some top poker players that are rockin live and avoid to play online like Erik Seidel for example. The problem is that many of these people that lose big time on online poker aren't too succesuful in the live poker. Probably they play less hands live and thats why they think it's more profitable to play live, but the truth is that volume kill variance.
------------ And sorry but you are wrong about not providing long number probable testing being the only proof. RNG means that given an infinite number of hands the chances of every card situation are equal and your odds of getting high card, flush, fullhouse etc are exactly as they should be.
Total rubbish before you come back with further verbal bull answer this. What is the difference between random and expected outcome(Truely random) Answer this and we can make some headway. God no wonder these sites pull the wool over you guys eyes.
------------ If you understand something of programing software, you know you can created a simpled random answer program with only two possiblities: "yes" and "no" and, although each one has 50% of probabilities of happening, nothing says that, after having a "no" (same as loosing with AA all in pre-flop), you will have a "yes" (winning AA all in pre-flop in the same conditions, position, etc.) in the same room. Probabilities are the same so... its like throwing a coin to see if it is crown or face, and it can result face 20 times in a row. Its possible to happen so, no one can have nothing against that.
long number testing will give an equal amount of heads or tails within 1% that is another fact of long number testing
------------ And sorry but you are wrong about not providing long number probable testing being the only proof. RNG means that given an infinite number of hands the chances of every card situation are equal and your odds of getting high card, flush, fullhouse etc are exactly as they should be.
an RNG cannot control the data it is given to draw a selection from and it certainly isnt capable of scanning said data to see if there is a bias or not. Do some research
------------ you keep saying 100 hands on i poker for a real test you need way more, why do you try at least 10,000 or 100,000 then maybe you will have something to argue with and show us proof not just turn up and say FACT lol
tbh you just seem like a lonely bitter man to me, so thats me done with your threads as im sure most are bored with you now
you wanted facts , I gave a small dose theres plenty more And again why do none of the sites carry out tests of expected outcome ??? open your fkin eyes. why do gambling commissions allow deal manipulation??? open your eyes. why are there bigger twists online than live . open your eyes
------------ who cares joke get over it...........rigged or not we all still play and even if it were proved to be true wed still all play. if u dont like online poker then dont play its simple!. maybe this ONLINE poker forum just aint for u
Fair points accept you over look I love poker and fight for a straight deal. By the way card manipulation is fraud done as it is now
------------ who cares joke get over it...........rigged or not we all still play and even if it were proved to be true wed still all play. if u dont like online poker then dont play its simple!. maybe this ONLINE poker forum just aint for u
Fair points accept you over look I love poker and fight for a straight deal. By the way card manipulation is fraud done as it is now
------------ People are free to think what they want really, if you really think online poker is rigged and always the people that win at the table on which you play are bots or people that "work" for the poker platform it's strictly your opinion. In time i learned that it's useless to convience people that you can actually have fun and win money online. If they have succes on live poker it's really okay, there are some top poker players that are rockin live and avoid to play online like Erik Seidel for example. The problem is that many of these people that lose big time on online poker aren't too succesuful in the live poker. Probably they play less hands live and thats why they think it's more profitable to play live, but the truth is that volume kill variance.
Nice post I played and made live and online but online far more real bad stitch ups so on I fight for an honest deal. GL bud
------------ lol bored with this guy? nahhhhhhh that couldnt be? im more interested in the annoying popups i keep getting while catching up on my porn sites then anything this joke got to say
i have decided to hijack all these dumbass threads with some more annoying posts maybe ppl will get annoyed with me and let things be?
maybe i should take an hour and go through some pages and BUMP all decent poker threads back up so we can get ridda all the garbage thats been around latly and back to our poker goals/acomplishments? what u thnk flippedchips?
Joined: Feb '11
Location: Canada
Age: 39 (M)
Posts: 1660
Man the universe didn't end . . . Fact: The universe will end this week.
Does anyone do long probability test on live games? I would be more comfortable with a computer in anycase. It's easier for a dealer to rig a deck than it is to recode a site.
If you can't profit quit, as for me, I'm enjoying it.
Joined: Apr '09
Location: Australia
Age: 40 (M)
Posts: 6483
onlinejoke: The reason I can't be f**ked actually posting to sources to refute you're "facts" is because of two simple things:
1) There is very little point providing well-thought-out information to rigtards - you all simply ignore it, or twist it to mean something else. There is actually interesting scientific papers regarding this (on conspiracy theorists obviously, not specifically poker rigtards.
2) And this is the big one. Sample data. All of what you are trying to say can be tested by you and your rigtard mates. I've said it so many f**king times in so many f**king threads it is not funny. Use a HH tracker, gather a large sample and analyse it. Poker Stars in fact, in the interest in being open regarding this, will even go so far as to provide you your entire HH if you request it from them. Now here's the thing, if you Google on this - you can actually see people have done this already and no evidence was found that deals/rngs were rigged. Do it yourself. Then come back.
None of the rest of what you have to say means jack s**t in the face of empirical data. Either provide scientific/empirical evidence to support your hypothesis - like any legitimate claim needs to do. Or shut the f**k up.
------------ jessthehuman onlinejoke: The reason I can't be f**ked actually posting to sources to refute you're "facts" is because of two simple things:
What a donk , How do you refute a fact. We sure sent all our bad stock to aus and the gene pool sure suffers to this day.
------------ jessthehuman 1) There is very little point providing well-thought-out information to rigtards - you all simply ignore it, or twist it to mean something else. There is actually interesting scientific papers regarding this (on conspiracy theorists obviously, not specifically poker rigtards.
