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Joined: Nov '09
Location: Canada
Age: 55 (M)
Posts: 2387
Some of you seem very adept at reading information from graphs, so I am interested in your opinions for this. I regularly play 6 person turbo SNGs on 888. Up until the beginning of the year there was a Russian player (that everyone suspected of being a bot) at the $2.50 BI level. He never chatted and always played exactly the same way, very predictable and lots of all-ins when the blinds go up. He was making about 4% ROI, when suddenly he seemed to be trying $5.00 BI, but that didn’t work too well and he came back down to $2.50 for a while before suddenly stopping.
I have started playing $5.00 BI 6 person turbos for a few months now, and I have noticed a Russian player who plays exactly the same style as the bot I played against at $2.50 BI. Interesting though is to look at his graph. He seemed to be muddling through it until he had played 2500 games when BANG! Things started to take off. Small programming change maybe? What do you guys think, bot or not?
Joined: Mar '09
Location: Greece
Age: 47 (F)
Posts: 14136
It happened about 3-4 days to read some things about bots and it seems that bots in iPoker taking the place out. Too many of them and they cant control and ban all of them. It seems like one. The only thing you can do is tag such players and stay away from them. A report to the management to have a look at the account wouldnt be a bad idea either
Joined: Nov '10
Location: Serbia
Age: 37 (M)
Posts: 2087
Hi Mahd. Everything is possible but... I dont think so... Just, these small buy in turbos that you talk about are ABC thing. When people play them (especially when they multi-table them) they play straight forward. Because, on every table there is at least 3 donks that dont even notice how you play or they dont care because they came to gamble. So, no need to do anything funky to have edge. Maybe after 2500 games he made some radical adjustment to his game+good upswing= big confidence... Maybe, that is same guy on his fathers, mothers, brothers name or they maybe both wathed videos from same coach... Anyway, when you are multi-tabling you dont have time to chat...
Joined: Nov '09
Location: Canada
Age: 55 (M)
Posts: 2387
Posted by Mober: The only thing you can do is tag such players and stay away from them.
Actually I have made good calls on a few of his all ins recently to beat him out for the win. The thing about bots is that they play very predictably, and when you have a very good idea of what somebody is holding, than they are contravening David Sklansky's Fundamental Theorem of Poker: “Every time you play a hand differently from the way you would have played it if you could see all your opponents' cards, they gain; and every time you play your hand the same way you would have played it if you could see all their cards, they lose. Conversely, every time opponents play their hands differently from the way they would have if they could see all your cards, you gain; and every time they play their hands the same way they would have played if they could see all your cards, you lose.”
Joined: Mar '11
Location: Canada
Age: 44 (M)
Posts: 1490
Not a lot of experience playing 6max sngs, but I have quite a few thousand 9mans under my belt, and I can say that he's probably just a very ABC player. Anyone with a good grasp of ICM and nash equilibrium can be an absolute beast at them.
And as stated, if he's multi-tabling, it's very likely he won't chat. It's hard to have time to chat, when you're playing 5+ tables, especially if you're shorthanded/on or past the bubble on a few of them, since action moves so much faster.
Plus he's russian, so he may not have a clue what you're trying to say
Joined: Feb '11
Location: Germany
Age: 31 (M)
Posts: 1859
Chances are he simply learned a proper SNG strategy. Breakevening or even losing at these stakes over a 2.5K games sample can't really be explained with variance,so if this isn't a bot it'd be my only explaination
Joined: Jan '10
Location: Indonesia
Age: 60 (M)
Posts: 1875
Maybe he is very lucky, lol. What's advantage for site if they use bot. quickly profit then they lost their player. I think poker site is long term bussines.
I agree bots are predictable. I have played against lots of them. The more agressive programs are beatable,but, one must be very patient, timing is everything. I look at it as me against two programs. I believe most of my bad beats and suckouts are bot related. That's why I prefer the smaller newer sites to play on...haven't been infiltrated as of yet and higher probability of playing against people.. The large sites all have them. I can get one but I don't want one. I like playing and winning or losing on my own accord. They work well as they are designed to build a bankroll while one sleeps...the stats prove they are successful. Site =rake=profit...don't relly think it matters how it's generated as long as there is rake. Bots can play plenty of tables and of course on more than one site. So they will generate much more in rake from a supported bankroll. There have been invite only all bot tourneys in the past and I'm sure there will be more. I get a detailed email about every four months or so from a bot company and have been for about four years. One can just push play or reconfigure any program to suit...it's just not for me...eithics thingy, besides it's a rush when one beats it at it's own game.
Joined: Apr '11
Location: Romania
Age: 35 (M)
Posts: 6669
Hard to tell actually, still i know players can submit a complain to the poker platform support to investigate a certain player if you feel that is something wrong and most of all you you lost money to him...
Did you noticed if he plays uberhuman sessions, like 24 or more hours??
Joined: Nov '09
Location: Canada
Age: 55 (M)
Posts: 2387
Well, a lot of you don’t feel he is a bot, and after playing against him a few more times I think I see some differences between him and the guy I also thought was a bot at lower limits. Based on his play I think, like jovica said, he is just multitabling and playing ABC poker. To change direction in his game obviously something major happened.
When minimum BI at full stack tables was 20 bb, I used to definitely see bots… especially from China.
Joined: Jun '11
Location: United Kingdom
Age: 52 (M)
Posts: 1332
i don't see how he can get such a big upswing in his game ,it seems to me that ,as charts go that's very impressive for that reason i'm going to say it is a bot and now as i know feck all about how bots work i'm going to go and learn about them..
If this senario is not bot related I'd be very surprized. Looks like this one is set up for bonus whoring. It's a common practice amoung bot users. They take great pride in crushing large deposit and reload deposit bonuses. If I'm in error, this person has one large lucky streak going on. Then again if I cud calculate reverse pot odds is less time it takes to blind an eye, my graph might look like that as well.
Joined: May '11
Location: Canada
Age: 34 (M)
Posts: 979
Posted by Flippedchips: im sure this guy is a bot to plays tons of tables and his stats are sick his name is nanonoko check him out on PTR
haha
------------ plus he only won 1500$ over 6000 games, imo thats horrible, i would crush them all if i could be consist without my tiltjuice but micro nits ruin my game, i just dont like nits at all, its so much funner to play post flop
Joined: Nov '09
Location: Canada
Age: 55 (M)
Posts: 2387
Posted by callie28: i don't see how he can get such a big upswing in his game ,it seems to me that ,as charts go that's very impressive for that reason i'm going to say it is a bot
I know what you mean. I have followed certain players on PTR over the years, and seen them progress and become better players playing higher limits and so on, but when you look at their graphs you can see how they are learning, going through some dips and downswings but overall their graph is going up over a long period of time. This guy is breakeven for a long time and then just shoots up and maintains that. If I had a graph like that I would be at least playing the next level up, but ALL of his are at $5.00 BI! Interesting...
Joined: Apr '09
Location: Portugal
Age: 44 (M)
Posts: 4827
That graph is amazing… the question is very good too. Let’s see: it could be someone very limited in terms of knowledge of the game, someone who has been told to “do this with this hands, do that with that hands, don’t do nothing with the rest of the hands”. I have some friends who defend that if we follow something like this, we can win, although few if in low levels, regular monthly profit with poker. I never tried. In a room like 888, I think its hard for a bot to “live” there for so long.
Joined: Apr '11
Location: Romania
Age: 35 (M)
Posts: 6669
The information about randy is true, he is indeed a pokerstars pro that now moved to canada in order to be able to play at pokerstars...
He first started with video games where he developed his skill to do multiple things in thesame time thats why he is able to play at so many tables at once
Joined: Mar '09
Location: Greece
Age: 47 (F)
Posts: 14136
Like how many things you can do along while you play a video game? having a drink or a smoke maybe? Or even all three of them? Its all about getting focused and not getting dizzy. You need to have coordination skills too.
