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Zero Risk + Experience = Rewards Eventually.


     
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i like them because its free but i hate them because it have 2many bad players and most of them u spent hours playin just 2 earn a few cents

     
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It really depends on what freerolls are we talking about, i mean freerolls with many russians and participants and low prize pool don't worth your time...

On the other hand you can find freerolls with less participants and bigger prize pools that really worth to play Blink

     
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I like freeroll because there are plenty of fish and I train with them even if not playing for who knows what amount of money. May I love that there are plenty of tournaments per day and I hope to continue for at least two - three months this freeroll !

     
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In my opinion,freerolls are good practice for the real turbo tournaments, it is pretty similar,all the players wants to increase their stacks very fast.

     
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We need to know very clear about freeroll. Very unpredictable there, so just use it to test your luck and feeling, push and fold. As warming up is good, we don't need pay. So no need think to much about freeroll, that's just for exercise Big Smile Big Smile

     
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freerolls are great for one serious reason- they are free! so if you find there is 0$ sitting comfortably in your account freerolls are the way to go (if for one reason or another you do not want to deposit), so with all their pros and cons they are just one form of poker that is going to stay Aww crap!

     
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i think the freerolls form BRM in pokerstars are good but i hate the donks who are linking the password for every tourney and there are so much fish coming that in this blind lvls its up to luck to cash no skill just constanly at any stage of the tourney people move all in with K8 J7 A3 and other junk and this is all in preflop and many are moving with str8 draws with only for outs i think the managment has to think for 5 min release of the password and no late reg because i think this is unfair to the players and GUYS STOP LEAKING THE PASSWORD PLS dont get the idea why you do that you have a chance for the leaderboard and you have better chance for making money if you dont leak it

     
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Posted by jessthehuman:
Posted by Arithmajik:

Just out of curiosity do you feel the same way about most freerolls, even the ones you earn when newly depositing and such, or would you class those slightly differently from these $25 ones? I don't play these for all the reasons above but I do play almost all the ones I qualify for through promotions and what not.

Just curious.


What I was saying was certainly just a generalisation. My way of determining the value of a freeroll isn't the prizepool, I simply use this equation:

total prizepool / total runners = Value of entrance

So for example, if it's some kind of special members freeroll or something like that (restricted freeroll) and it is $10K and 2000 runners (PKR used to have a monthly one like this) then it is:

$10,000 / 2000 = $5 Value

So basically, if the value of the entrance is equal to the MTTs you usually play, or close to - then the freeroll is 'worth your time'. If however you're talking about $500 / 10,000 runners and value of entrance = $0.05 (5c) - then even if the top prize is $100, then i still don't think it's worth the effort - it's essentially a 5c buyin MTT. And you might say - "yeh, but I could win $100!"- but the reality is, if your MTT ROI is 30% for example, then your EV for entering the freeroll is around 6c-7c - for what, 2-3hrs average time? Not good.

So - in saying that, from time to time, you certainly come across restricted freerolls (1st depositors, club-member, etc) that have pretty decent value- Sometimes you'll even get the odd one where your entrance is worth $10.00-$30.00!

------------
PKR up until fairly recently ran a monthly SNG/MTT rankings freeroll - $5,000. 1,000 people qualified and normally about 500 or so registered. So the value for that was normally $5,000 / 500 = $10.00 entrance.

I used to try and play that whenever I was able to (not often, due to timezone issues) - also, it was good to play because you were playing vs the top 500-1000 players on the site, so obviously bragging rights were in the mix too!



Thanks for your thoughts. I like the way you approach it, it makes sense for sure. And that's a good simple way of determining value for sure. Also good point bringing the ROI in and using it to estimate what your expectation for effort will be. At best if I'm going to play any low value ones I add it in addition to what I'd normally play and not pay very close attention.

     
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Posted by Arithmajik:
At best if I'm going to play any low value ones I add it in addition to what I'd normally play and not pay very close attention.


This is an excellent point as well. If you're playing poker anyway and have spare "places" for an extra table, then there is very little harm in firing up a freeroll and paying it only a small amount of attention. So long as it's no detracting too much attention from more important games, then it's a pretty good way of having a crack at a freeroll without "wasting your time" so to speak. Obviously if you happen to hit the final table of the freeroll, then you can focus some more attention on it.


But yes - very good point and an excellent way to include freerolls in your schedule!

     
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Pros:
- it's free Smile so we can build bankroll
- there are plenty of bankrolls, so everyone finds some for himself

Cons:[/]
- all-in's festival!

     
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Posted by Mysik86:
Cons:[/]
- all-in's festival!


I'd actually put that one down as a Pro; weak field.

     
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No real experience, if players do not play with their cash, they play not reasonable.
Such experience is worthless on real cash tables.

     
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Sometimes it's a PRO, but when you have high cards, like: AA, AK, AQ, KK, etc., you go to all-in and some donk call with cards like 85 and the flop is 755 - it's so annoying!

     
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In fact, I started with freerolls as there was no money for a normal game of poker, but the game certainly is not a lot of fish is sweet, but for me it was a challenge just to go ahead in any manner that would chop the capital that would have to play a more serious tournaments, and if honestly you do not like freerolls Smile

     
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Posted by Mysik86:
Sometimes it's a PRO, but when you have high cards, like: AA, AK, AQ, KK, etc., you go to all-in and some donk call with cards like 85 and the flop is 755 - it's so annoying!


Yes, I agree with that - nothing tilts me more than losing to morons.. It's weird -as much as I really really really do appreciate all the stupid calls; when they hit - it drives me crazy, so much more so than if I got outplayed, or a cooler, or a flip or whatever.. losing to idiots.. just feels like a waste..


still though, I would much rather have a table full of all-in donkeys, than sharks.

     
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freerolls are great. It gives u an oppurtunity to practice tournament play for free Smile and also to learn how to deal with maniacs in the beggining stages.

     
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I like playing freerolls....especially the BRM ones.... as they dont cost me anything to play. I appreciate the frustrations som e players have, and I experience them too.....all ins on nothing hands.....but it has the advantage of developing my patience...Im pretty imaptient at times...and these freerolls reaaly require patience as someone said above. I would love to kick the habiot, and spend some money playing, but dont get the time at the right times to play the tourneys Id like to. Maybe I need to quit work and focus on Poker!

Anyway...keep up the good work BRM ...your freerolls are ace.

     
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PokerStars Hand #77089785935: Tournament #519905799, Freeroll Hold'em No Limit - Level XIV (800/1600) - 2012/03/12 18:13:56 ET
Table '519905799 353' 9-max Seat #9 is the button
Seat 1: bundle711 (29555 in chips)
Seat 2: dragonina (16950 in chips) is sitting out
Seat 3: Makc86 (13025 in chips)
Seat 4: balagur670 (25244 in chips)
Seat 5: Okam1Rllzzz (62016 in chips)
Seat 6: 7hYr0 (13310 in chips)
Seat 7: Kféh (28474 in chips)
Seat 9: pergo78 (11553 in chips)
bundle711: posts the ante 150
dragonina: posts the ante 150
Makc86: posts the ante 150
balagur670: posts the ante 150
Okam1Rllzzz: posts the ante 150
7hYr0: posts the ante 150
Kféh: posts the ante 150
pergo78: posts the ante 150
bundle711: posts small blind 800
dragonina: posts big blind 1600
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to bundle711 [Ks Ah]
Makc86: folds
balagur670: folds
Okam1Rllzzz: calls 1600
7hYr0: folds
Kféh: folds
pergo78: raises 9803 to 11403 and is all-in
bundle711: raises 18002 to 29405 and is all-in
dragonina: folds
Okam1Rllzzz: folds
Uncalled bet (18002) returned to bundle711
*** FLOP *** [Qh 8c 6d]
*** TURN *** [Qh 8c 6d] Queen of clubs
*** RIVER *** [Qh 8c 6d Qc] 10 of hearts
*** SHOW DOWN ***
bundle711: shows [Ks Ah] (a pair of Queens)
pergo78: shows [Qd Kh] (three of a kind, Queens)
pergo78 collected 27206 from pot
*** SUMMARY ***
Total pot 27206 | Rake 0
Board [Qh 8c 6d Qc Th]
Seat 1: bundle711 (small blind) showed [Ks Ah] and lost with a pair of Queens
Seat 2: dragonina (big blind) folded before Flop
Seat 3: Makc86 folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 4: balagur670 folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 5: Okam1Rllzzz folded before Flop
Seat 6: 7hYr0 folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 7: Kféh folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 9: pergo78 (button) showed [Qd Kh] and won (27206) with three of a kind, Queens

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------


PokerStars Hand #77090009936: Tournament #519905799, Freeroll Hold'em No Limit - Level XV (1000/2000) - 2012/03/12 18:17:39 ET
Table '519905799 353' 9-max Seat #5 is the button
Seat 1: bundle711 (17352 in chips)
Seat 2: dragonina (13750 in chips) is sitting out
Seat 3: Makc86 (21325 in chips)
Seat 4: balagur670 (23394 in chips)
Seat 5: Okam1Rllzzz (61816 in chips)
Seat 6: 7hYr0 (8910 in chips)
Seat 7: Kféh (27674 in chips)
Seat 8: vidaboa89 (5863 in chips)
Seat 9: pergo78 (26556 in chips)
bundle711: posts the ante 200
dragonina: posts the ante 200
Makc86: posts the ante 200
balagur670: posts the ante 200
Okam1Rllzzz: posts the ante 200
7hYr0: posts the ante 200
Kféh: posts the ante 200
vidaboa89: posts the ante 200
pergo78: posts the ante 200
7hYr0: posts small blind 1000
Kféh: posts big blind 2000
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to bundle711 [Jh Ah]
vidaboa89: raises 3660 to 5660
pergo78: folds
bundle711: raises 11492 to 17152 and is all-in
dragonina: folds
Makc86: folds
balagur670: folds
Okam1Rllzzz: folds
7hYr0: folds
Kféh: folds
vidaboa89: calls 3 and is all-in
Uncalled bet (11489) returned to bundle711
*** FLOP *** [5h 4d 7s]
*** TURN *** [5h 4d 7s] 2 of hearts
*** RIVER *** [5h 4d 7s 2h] 8 of diamonds
*** SHOW DOWN ***
vidaboa89: shows [4s Qs] (a pair of Fours)
bundle711: shows [Jh Ah] (high card Ace)
vidaboa89 collected 16126 from pot
*** SUMMARY ***
Total pot 16126 | Rake 0
Board [5h 4d 7s 2h 8d]
Seat 1: bundle711 showed [Jh Ah] and lost with high card Ace
Seat 2: dragonina folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 3: Makc86 folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 4: balagur670 folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 5: Okam1Rllzzz (button) folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 6: 7hYr0 (small blind) folded before Flop
Seat 7: Kféh (big blind) folded before Flop
Seat 8: vidaboa89 showed [4s Qs] and won (16126) with a pair of Fours
Seat 9: pergo78 folded before Flop (didn't bet)


----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------


PokerStars Hand #77090585719: Tournament #519905799, Freeroll Hold'em No Limit - Level XVII (2000/4000) - 2012/03/12 18:27:23 ET
Table '519905799 353' 9-max Seat #3 is the button
Seat 1: bundle711 (30778 in chips)
Seat 2: dragonina (750 in chips) is sitting out
Seat 3: Makc86 (42250 in chips)
Seat 4: balagur670 (40765 in chips)
Seat 5: Okam1Rllzzz (56958 in chips)
Seat 6: 7hYr0 (13030 in chips)
Seat 7: Kféh (10646 in chips)
Seat 8: vidaboa89 (17663 in chips)
Seat 9: I SALCES (25080 in chips)
bundle711: posts the ante 400
dragonina: posts the ante 400
Makc86: posts the ante 400
balagur670: posts the ante 400
Okam1Rllzzz: posts the ante 400
7hYr0: posts the ante 400
Kféh: posts the ante 400
vidaboa89: posts the ante 400
I SALCES: posts the ante 400
balagur670: posts small blind 2000
Okam1Rllzzz: posts big blind 4000
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to bundle711 [8d 8h]
7hYr0: folds
Kféh: folds
vidaboa89: raises 13262 to 17262
I SALCES: folds
bundle711: raises 13116 to 30378 and is all-in
dragonina: folds
Makc86: folds
balagur670: folds
Okam1Rllzzz: folds
vidaboa89: calls 1 and is all-in
Uncalled bet (13115) returned to bundle711
*** FLOP *** [As 7s Jd]
*** TURN *** [As 7s Jd] 6 of clubs
*** RIVER *** [As 7s Jd 6c] 2 of clubs
*** SHOW DOWN ***
vidaboa89: shows [7d Ac] (two pair, Aces and Sevens)
bundle711: shows [8d 8h] (a pair of Eights)
vidaboa89 collected 44126 from pot
*** SUMMARY ***
Total pot 44126 | Rake 0
Board [As 7s Jd 6c 2c]
Seat 1: bundle711 showed [8d 8h] and lost with a pair of Eights
Seat 2: dragonina folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 3: Makc86 (button) folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 4: balagur670 (small blind) folded before Flop
Seat 5: Okam1Rllzzz (big blind) folded before Flop
Seat 6: 7hYr0 folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 7: Kféh folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 8: vidaboa89 showed [7d Ac] and won (44126) with two pair, Aces and Sevens
Seat 9: I SALCES folded before Flop (didn't bet)


-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

I am not posting this to moan, or claim any rigging before the rigtard squad get here. I merely add them here as I think in each hand I did little wrong. But I got humped (yes I know I was coin flipping in last one. But the first two were donk downs. The tilt control I have in a free roll is unreal. And I think there is some value in attempting to transfer this to your real money games. I have improved a lot over the years with doing this.

After clearing that up the free rolls here are turbo and in a turbo you are looking for a slight edge. If you think some douche is capable of pushing KJ off you snap him with your pocket 4s. As the poker stars adds say lady luck hangs out with the guys who practice the hardest.

Finally, just because a tourney costs to enter doesn't mean it isn't full of donkeys. $5 isn't even above a £5 in cost compared to a pub game where people call with any two. I will admit that the tendency to more thought out play increases as rewards and risks for failure increase.

     
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Posted by jessthehuman:
Posted by Mysik86:
Sometimes it's a PRO, but when you have high cards, like: AA, AK, AQ, KK, etc., you go to all-in and some donk call with cards like 85 and the flop is 755 - it's so annoying!


Yes, I agree with that - nothing tilts me more than losing to morons.. It's weird -as much as I really really really do appreciate all the stupid calls; when they hit - it drives me crazy, so much more so than if I got outplayed, or a cooler, or a flip or whatever.. losing to idiots.. just feels like a waste..


still though, I would much rather have a table full of all-in donkeys, than sharks.



Ha ha, yeah. Couldn't agree more, no loss burns as bad as the one you "should've" won. On the plus side Mysik86 you could look at it this way: If you get put out early you can move on to more lucrative things. I'd rather be put out early with a bad beat then 10 away from the money with a close call.

At Exostenz and Damosk: Certainly, if you're just playing for entertainment and practice enjoy, that's what they're for. Try track your results though so you'll know when you're ready to try moving up to the next level.

     
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