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Posted by jessthehuman: How am I the only one fascinated by this claim? Is this not setting off alarm bells for anyone else? Come on! This guy is claiming to BEAT the pub slots.. In the same breadth as he is crying about losing $42! I mean, which is it?!
Surely it's impossible to be a "professional" in games with a house edge, unless you have some way to turn the odds in your favor (like the MIT crew did with counting cards in black jack, back in the day).
The logical explanation therefore is that anyone claiming to be a professional, believes these professionals do exist, due to a lack of understanding of why it's not possible, and is simply pretending to be one of them...
Joined: Apr '09
Location: Australia
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Posted by marqis: The logical explanation therefore is that anyone claiming to be a professional, believes these professionals do exist, due to a lack of understanding of why it's not possible, and is simply pretending to be one of them...
Yes - that is my conclusion as well. If you read through that wall of text I quoted from him, he goes on to say his "special techniques" are literally the same thing that all the losing slots-degens go on about - ways of trying to trick the ways they perceive the slots to be programmed.. They think there are special times to bet and such, by second guessing the slot machines.
I can guarantee the slots aren't programmed in any way that can be beaten like this, that would be stupid. Obviously people would catch on to it and ultimately beat the system. Which is exactly why it is just random with a house edge, too easy.
Joined: Feb '08
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Posted by jessthehuman:
Posted by awood88:
Posted by gmgm: explain this, your in a 42 dollar sng 500 start chips you get upto 1740 then u get disconnected u cant log in yet i can log in with another profie so log out and try to log in again but wont let me until game is over, i was listening to a internet radio station with no breaks 888 tell me if it was a fault from my end , it wasnt . no way
To be honest I do believe this might have happened. I too have been playing a tourney and lost connection when my internet seemed to be working I would like to get some info on why this happens (maybe cookies or bad software)
I can tell you why it usually happens (The reason you lose connection to a poker site and not other Internet applications)
Poker sites don't use regular ports, all Internet traffic is routed through ports. Basically - for whatever reason you lose the route through to that specific port. On PKR it's especially annoying as they use different ports for every different table and it's not uncommon to be 'disconnected' just from one or two tables while another 6+ are running fine.
Without going into more detail regarding how networking actually works, the things you can do to prevent this are:
Find out what ports and protocols the poker site you play on uses, then:
Set your poker playing computer to STATIC IP address, then log into your router and set up port-forwarding (this is probably the most important thing) : you then forward all internal and external ports through to your computers IP (the one you set statically) . People with VoIP phones are probably familiar with this process, likewise those how use remote access software behind a NAT (and the NAT is what is making the connection drop is most cases, btw).
Once you have your port forwards set correctly - you should also prioritise the poker traffic in any way you can, generally under a router heading of QoS (quality of service).
Lastly - and this one isn't always feasible but it's worth checking that your ISP doesn't use certain QoS rules that drop non-HTTP traffic during peak times, or anything like that. Sometimes they'll randomly block or limit common P2P ports as well.
Thanks Jess but I'm afraid it's all over my head lol. I figured it would have something to do with a particular port but I regularly have trouble with my internet. And not being any more computer literate than the average student I have given up on fixing the issues. My laptop seems pretty sensitive to internet problems, my provider (virgin media) is cheap but undoubtedly one of the worst providers and I recently found out my city (swansea) has the second slowest average speed in the UK.
Regarding slot machines I'm not sure that pub slots work in the same way as casino slots and online slots. I am no expert but I know that plenty of people claim they can win pub slots by watching it til it's ready to pay out. I have heard that they are programmed to pay out after a number of spins, so the chances of winning the jackpot are nonexistent in the few spins after the jackpot goes. Saying that I also know people who are convinced the machine is going to pay out so they keep going to the bar to get change (they are also convinced coins makes the machine feel more full than notes) and then the machine takes another £30 to pay out £50, and they think they've won. (They've actually put £60 in but have selective memory)
What is clear though, is that the OP really can't be trusted since he backs up his claims with such rubbish. That particular paragraph says it all. He claims that he knows what an RNG is and then says the RNG uses variables to figure out who wins, not that the RNG doesn't exist. And then he claims a computer can calculate who is more likely to deposit and makes them lose. The fact that fixing the results to make people pay more is far more complex than creating a fair game and that manipulating the game is more likely to send players away than attract more, seem to not be considered.
Joined: Apr '09
Location: Australia
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Posted by awood88:
To be honest I do believe this might have happened. I too have been playing a tourney and lost connection when my internet seemed to be working I would like to get some info on why this happens (maybe cookies or bad software)
Google port forwarding: it's worth it and really not that hard to do.. You just need to edit your Network connection properties, then edit TCP/IP v4 properties and change the IP address setting from "obtain automatically" to "use the following" then enter in your IP/gateway/subnet - you can just copy the ones that were automatically assigned if you're unsure on how IP ranging and subnetting works.
Then look up port-forward instructions for your router, worth doing : /
Posted by awood88: Regarding slot machines I'm not sure that pub slots work in the same way as casino slots and online slots. I am no expert but I know that plenty of people claim they can win pub slots by watching it til it's ready to pay out. I have heard that they are programmed to pay out after a number of spins, so the chances of winning the jackpot are nonexistent in the few spins after the jackpot goes. Saying that I also know people who are convinced the machine is going to pay out so they keep going to the bar to get change (they are also convinced coins makes the machine feel more full than notes) and then the machine takes another �30 to pay out �50, and they think they've won. (They've actually put �60 in but have selective memory)
Nup. These same people exist at all levels of Australian slots to: Casino slots, pub slots, whatever. They all come up with crazy theories as to when it's likely to pay. And yes the idea that they won't pay again shortly after a recent jackpot is a common one, but completely false. They're all false, that's why these people are all degenerate losers hanging around pub slots. Trust me - these ideas aren't unique to UK pub slots - people have all kinds of stupid theories when it comes to slots anyway (and online) and they're all wrong. I've actually even seen some code for slot machines. It's simply not the way they work.
I used to even be a slot-degen myself, wasted years and thousands of dollars - although I NEVER believed I could beat them, I just wasn't in a happy place in life, I went to lose, simple as that. But I met all these people, they were all degenerate losers. All of them. You can't beat slots.
Think about it logically - WHY would they program them in a way that you could easily beat by learning the 'rules' by which they paid out? The simple and correct answer is "they wouldn't be and aren't".
Joined: Mar '11
Location: Canada
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Posted by gmgm: im aware of these statistics i beat slots proffesionally
You do realise how retarded you look by saying that? If you had any idea of the concept of basic math, you'd know how flawed that statement is. Slots literally can not be beaten. They are designed to give back only 95% of what they take in. So out of $1,000,000 put in, they only pay out $950,000. That right there is the biggest reason why slots are literally unbeatable. And in SOME regulated areas, the required payout can be as low as 87%. And that's ONLY live casinos. Online casinos, I'd image the payout is even lower.
Posted by gmgm: i have common sense a level maths
I have a hard time believing that.
Posted by gmgm: and 3 years at 888 and the stats u say u should see sadly u dont its not like that at all
Sample size please? Anything short of 1,000,000 hands is unacceptable. Any one who's done any research in the subject would tell you that.
Posted by gmgm: so dont make me out to be some kind of moron,
Yeah, I don't need to, you do a good enough job of that yourself
Posted by gmgm: and not all the games are rigged just high value ones or occasionally bad beat after bad beat when the rng would like you 2 deposit,
Ahh, so sometimes only high value games are rigged, and sometimes any are rigged because the RNG wants you to deposit? And just how does a math program make decisions on it's own? I wasn't aware the "online poker" rigged conspiracy reached so far, that it developed sentient programs capable of making their own decisions. Wow, that's some deeps stuff.
Posted by gmgm: the only way 888 gets away with it is riding on that chance element in life
Here's where your argument implodes on itself. Because your argument is that the RNG is flawed, yet your argument that they rely on the chance element is the one reason why poker ISN'T rigged. Because given that anything involving random math introduces the element of variance, ie: when an unlikely event occurs. But with a large enough sample size, the chances out any given event happening outside it's expected window of frequency moves closer to 0. Ie: if you're a 1% chance to win, you COULD win 99 times out of 100, as unlikely as it is. But after say 10,000,000,000,000 events, then the chance of it happening more than it should is unlikely.
Posted by gmgm: , afterall wouldnt u like someone u can trust to investigate these sites and give you a better assesment of it being fair? and not a third party of the government that recieves huge royalties from that firm which they investigate
I'm pretty sure people at the PPA have done audits, based on hand histories the community pooled together. As well, various other players on 2+2, and many other prominent sites have also done collective audits. I'm pretty sure they're on the up and up.
Posted by gmgm: i had bank roll of 842 i cashed 800 , i didnt want to play there anymore is that ok
So why not just withdraw it all, instead of wasting $42. That's like a full tank of gas, a night out with your mates, or even a lap dance or 3
Posted by gmgm: are u some kind of a fucking troll, wheres ur fellow brm member respect
I'm pretty sure you won't find any here bud, especially with the way you insist on talking to us. As for MY respect, well you never had it, but if you did, you would have lost it the second you started a "Poker is rigged" thread.
Joined: Jan '12
Location: United Kingdom
Age: 49 (M)
Posts: 2
hi gm. I agree it sould b reported to watch dog. I lost with kk and aa 9 times out of 10. im not a bitter person but im a fair person. ive been playing there 3 years. but relised after a year playing im geting ripped off bad beat after badbeat. so i just play doller games now. we all like to moan but the maths dont add up at 888. its one big scam. people think there generous with there freerolls.. but look who win them and watch there name disappear forever lol. no offence but i love the idiots who say I LOVE 888 ive only been playing for a few months and im winning... thats part of the scam. come back and say the same in 3 years. the only reason im still there is becos i will never deposit again but enjoy the set up and the team games.. the truth will come out one day... anyone with half a brain knows its rigged so badly.. just play small there and enjoy laughing at the badbeats.. good luck all
like all the nob heads say on here........ and there actually right. If you 100% sure there rigged.......simple don't play on the site again ...problem solved
------------ The way I've worked it out is that when you have days like that....days where you can't win no matter what you do ....when the Russian donks are hitting and winning with everythin and anything , just get off the site mate its not worth it ....no matter what you do your gonna lose. Just close the site down and try again another day
------------ Its easy to see when these motha fukas have the software on UPTHEBUM mode, just watch the tables and watch how many bad beats everyone is getting...
------------ And the problem with losing connection then not being able to log back in even when your conn is fine.....when this happens I ring them and they say oh where having some problems at the moment keep trying to log back....the problem should be solved soon ....
They had that problem for a long time.
------------ And by the way you won't get anywhere moaning about it on here coz half of them get paid to defend the sites and the other half are little kiss ass pokerstar pimps that don't wanna believe that there dumb enough to be depositing on a site that rips you off. Like you said not doesn't take a rocket scientist to work out out .... one day the whistle will get blown and u won't here a peep out these big hero defenders
One more thing if you do your research you will see it can't be proven 100% that any of the big sites are rigged and it also can't be proven 100% there not rigged ...
But what we can be 100% about is that if any of these big sites wanted 100% proof they are not rigged they could get it
------------ Asks the question why don't they?????
------------ That's why they set these companies up in Costa Rica places like that ....the laws out there are great for a greedy scamming crooks ....
------------ Why do you think you never see any of the pros playing high stakes or come to think of it why don't u see anyone playing high stakes lol if the integrity of these sites where good then you would have thousands of high stakes cash players every day and night ....
Edited by my_bankroll (19 February 2013 @ 17:13 GMT)
Joined: Jun '11
Location: United Kingdom
Age: 68 (M)
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lol
------------ Google port forwarding: it's worth it and really not that hard to do.. You just need to edit your Network connection properties, then edit TCP/IP v4 properties and change the IP address setting from "obtain automatically" to "use the following" then enter in your IP/gateway/subnet - you can just copy the ones that were automatically assigned if you're unsure on how IP ranging and subnetting works.
Then look up port-forward instructions for your router, worth doing : /
Joined: Mar '10
Location: United Kingdom
Age: 44 (M)
Posts: 75
when i played on 888 for a few weeks i seen about 3 royal flushes about 50 straight flushes about 200 quads and every flop was a action flop withabout 3 players going all in been playing on bwin for about 6 months now and not seen a royle flush rarley see a straght flush or quads i think somethings not right with 888
Joined: Apr '11
Location: Romania
Age: 35 (M)
Posts: 6669
Manuste, on what limits and what game did you played on 888poker?
I only ask because i usually play cash PLO there, usually PLO25, rarely PLO50 and i think so far i only saw one straight flush and probably 4 quads over a 5-6 months period...
Joined: Dec '12
Location: United Kingdom
Age: 43 (M)
Posts: 107
The royal jackpot is won at least twice a day ....wtf is all that about, having said that it still makes pokerstars look like the Vatican
------------ You only seen 4 quads in 5-6 months ?????? I seen 4 quads in 50 hands in one Texas no limit tournament ....wasn't complaining mind you coz I had 2 of them within 30 hands )
Edited by my_bankroll (19 February 2013 @ 21:18 GMT)
Joined: Feb '13
Location: United Kingdom
Age: 47 (F)
Posts: 2372
Hi
I just wanted to make a couple of comments on this thread.
Firstly, regarding beating the slots. I believe this IS possible. Where I was originally born, we had groups of players going around local pubs, cleaning them out, to the point where landlords would stop non-regulars playing them (the thought being that regulars stopped playing them, and the took less money). However, I am not in a position to discuss this in detail. However, I myself used to make decent money on them. Not in a 'win the jackpot' way but a slow and steady way. I would simply sit near the machine and watch people drop money in, then put in £2, take out £4 and buy myself a drink. I would do this all night long, night after night. (That is not to say that I didn't have some benders where I would get drunk and lose a lot, but when sober the system was sound ).
My second point is regarding losing streaks after a cash-out. I DO believe in these, they happen to me a lot, though I do NOT believe it is because the sites are rigged. Looking and analyzing a lot of my stats, it comes down to the way I play.
I am winning, confident, playing aggressive. Most pots I win before the river so I hardly ever take beats. Then I withdraw. And suddenly hit a losing streak, taking beats etc.
Turns out, with a smaller BR I am trying to 'earn back' what I have withdrawn, I am more cautious, give people a chance to hit their cards and invariably lose a fair bit.
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Ive done this a couple of times myself too. Watching others play the slots in a casino without getting any significant wins, and playing at the specific after they left. I was first introduced to that from some regular old ladies lol It works many times.
Some times though it gets annoying feeling them watching you over your shoulder as you play
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Posted by IceQueenAce:
My second point is regarding losing streaks after a cash-out. I DO believe in these, they happen to me a lot, though I do NOT believe it is because the sites are rigged. Looking and analyzing a lot of my stats, it comes down to the way I play.
Although I disagree with that slots statement I think this quote here is just awesome.. Finally someone who's putting some effort to find the true reasons behind their losing streaks and not just take the easy way and blame the site!
Joined: Mar '10
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LOL It makes me laugh all the same people keep coming on here telling you online poker is not rigged ! I do notice that the very same people dont seem to have played on 888poker ! so how can they make a judgement on a site they have not play on !!!! I know that 888 is rigged to fk and will never ever deposit on a online site again ! I am a winning player on nearly every site i have ever played on ! I have ran up my free bankroll from many different sites to triple figures on each site. I have won 100's from 888, luckyacepoker and WSOP (all sites under the 888 banner) But in my opinion its a joke ! its all rigged - Odds mean nothing on 888poker FACT I withdrew my winnings and left a little to play with ! ( Big mistake) once you have withdrawn you will see its impossible to ever build up your bankroll again ! I even started to doubt my ability/playing stlye , but then decide to open a new account on a sister site and play with the free money . Ran $12 upto $250 + in less than a day playing exactly the same games with exactly the same style ! Its all part of the con to get you to keep playing on the site ! I challenge anyone who thinks 888poker is not rigged to take the free money or deposit a maximum of $30 and play 500 games and then tell me its not rigged ! Jessthehuman - you are soooo quick to jump on any thread that doubts the honesty of online poker sites ! are you sure you and your gang dont work for these sites ???? Why comment on a thread about 888 being rigged when you clearly dont play on this site ?? If you are such a great player then accept my challenge and deposit $30 no more and see how you get on ! You see its like a cycle on this site - you start playing and BOOM you win and win and win . Then slowly but surely you lose and lose .so you deposit and Boom ,you win and win again. But if you ever withdraw most of your bankroll - Game over , dont expect to win again. I havent even mentioned the bad beats beyond a joke ! I laugh when i read people saying "you were only 95% to win that hand so you can expect to lose 5% of the time " and "keep playing because you will win in the long run getting in in good " Not on 888 - you might win when early on in a tournament or when the pot is small in a cash game ! The 5% of times you lose will be when deep in a tournament to a bigger stack or when there is $100s in the pot in a cash game. Retribution - another who is quick to jump on poker is rigged threads - but do you play on 888 ?? cant seem to find you on there maybe you could take up the 888 challenge to show us all how we are fkin rigtards who cant play poker
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Posted by kingfisha: I do notice that the very same people dont seem to have played on 888poker ! so how can they make a judgement on a site they have not play on !!!!
That is a fair point, it's just that people claim (not necessarily the same people) literally every single poker site is rigged. The reason we argue back the site(s) aren't rigged is because there is yet to be any solid evidence that they are (rigged).
That said - I wouldn't ever defend any of the really small sites (like Bulldog poker when it was still around, and any other sites that have about 100 people on them at peak-traffic). Playing on tiny/shady sites is definitely risky.
But with all the major poker sites, they stand to lose far more than gain by fixing their RNG. It breaches their gambling license for starters, not to mention potentially destroys their reputation. There is just no reason to do it - for a potential short-term gain right until the online community figures it out and then they are fucked and lose their license.
The reason we (anti-rigtards) get so upset with all this rigged nonsense is because you 'tards never provide any evidence (beyond your anecdotal tales of bad beats). You need to actually analyse 1 million+ hands and check for statistical anomalies, that is the evidence we'll accept because that is what it takes.
------------
Posted by kingfisha: of $30 and play 500 games and then tell me its not rigged !
If you are such a great player then accept my challenge and deposit $30 no more and see how you get on !
I played on 888 years ago and the software was awful and glitch back then, it was truly terrible, like there was graphical glitches on the chip-count display and s**t like that. I've heard the software is a LOT better now days, but it still brings back unpleasant memories so i don't play there.
But as I said before, I jump to the defence for these reasons:
A) I'm not specifically defending 888, it's just that every single poker room gets accused of being rigged, because every poker room has losing players, like you.
B) They don't stand to gain anything (long term) by rigging their RNG and there's no way they'd still be operating if it was rigged
C) You (rigtards) never provide the required statistical analyses to evidence your (outrageous) claims. That is why we laugh at you, because you fail science. And when these analyses are done, they invariable show that statistically speaking, the sites are within expectation and hence the RNGs aren't rigged.
Even how you describe how you lose the 5% against a big stack or in a cash game in a big pot (although this doesnt make sense, because NOT everyone can lose the big pot, someone has to win it). Regardless. You can test this - just run a million hands through HEM / PT and filter for pots > 200bb or tournament hands where you're against a big stack.. You can test all of this and yet you don't. So we laugh at you. And we defend the sites, against claims with no foundation.
Your "Experience" of 888 is fucking meaningless. No one gives a s**t if you took a bunch of bad beats, or had a 100BI down-swing. So fucking what? That doesn't make a site rigged, it means you've either been unlucky or, more likely, you're either s**t at poker - or you're good at poker, but not good enough to beat the rake (the rake is the real villain, let me tell you).
If you want your claims to be taken seriously, then instead of banging on about bad beats and crazy big-stack theories, actually provide meaningful data/evidence to support YOUR claim.
------------
Posted by kingfisha:
Ran $12 upto $250 + in less than a day playing exactly the same games with exactly the same style !
You see its like a cycle on this site - you start playing and BOOM you win and win and win . Then slowly but surely you lose and lose .so you deposit and Boom ,you win and win again.
Crazy heaters like that mostly just suggest you're losing because you have bad bankroll management, by the way.. That is pretty much the only way you can go from $12 to $250 in a day. And it is also a sure way to lose it just as quick, which is what you're saying is happening. Try playing with a real bankroll management strategy (and I mean actually try doing this, not just reply to this by lying that you already do, I know you don't) - and see how you go.
Edited by jessthehuman (20 February 2013 @ 01:38 GMT)
Joined: Nov '12
Location: Canada
Age: 63 (F)
Posts: 589
Try playing with a real bankroll management strategy (and I mean actually try doing this, not just reply to this by lying that you already do, I know you don't) - and see how you go. [/QUOTE]
Joined: Apr '09
Location: Australia
Age: 40 (M)
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Posted by saynothing: Try playing with a real bankroll management strategy (and I mean actually try doing this, not just reply to this by lying that you already do, I know you don't) - and see how you go.
I am going to depo 25 on stars, and try that out [/QUOTE]
fwiw: bankroll management is for pussies
It's just that, I think it's worth trying before claiming a site is rigged because you play like a maniac and go from $12 to $250 to busto again in a matter of days.. that's just to be expected!
Joined: Nov '12
Location: Canada
Age: 63 (F)
Posts: 589
I totally understand, LOLz .................am I the only one , some people are just too hard headed to understand all the factors, and would just rather say it is Rigged because it is easy and there idiots.....obv not the sharpest tools in the shed around here LOLz.
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