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Would you have made that call?  0   
So, this happened to me in a homegame last week.
Blinds are 20c /40 c, getting higher over the evening.

The Game is 6 handed.

Im UTG ( stack: 102 Euros ) with 4c 5c.

Me: Raise to 2 Euros

SB call
BB call

Flop: 6d 7h 8h

SB ( a friend of mine , very lag, but usually backs down when you get back at him seriously, BB: cally wally, passive.)

SB: Bet - 6 Eur
BB: call 6 Eur

I thought about the possible holdings and decided to make the eventual draws pay a high price.

Me (UTG): Raise to 30 Eur

SB thinks for a while, asks me smth about implied odds I would try to give myself.At that point of time I knew he had decided to put me on a Flush draw, probably ace hi.

sb: call 30 Eur
BB: fold

Turn: Kd

I thought: perfect card for me. No free pair, no heart, no possible successful openender.

SB: checks.

Me: All in with 70 Euros.

He thinks for a long time and decides to make the call.

Me 4c 5c - Him: 7c 8d

I wanted to laugh out loud because of that lousy call. Then came the
river: 7 of spades.

So: my question: ( because I was quite angry afterwards, in my eyes a 10 $ dollar table call at party poker )

Would YOU have made that call? What would you have put me on on turn when I shoved?

Hopefully you would have folded, so I can laugh at him even louder .

Big Smile

Edited by Divinitas (13 August 2008 @ 17:30 GMT)

Difficult to put you on the flopped straight after your raise UTG. After the betting round at the flop you have only one PSB behind. So if he calls your bet on the flop, he has to be willing to stick it all in. And actually he should have raised you on the flop. If you were really on a draw an miss the turn it is much more unlikely that he will get money from you, espacially as he is oop.

Possably, depending,
2 pair on flop, and you raised pre flop, so he could put you on PP or A(and anouther),
looks like he knew youd try to push him off, and stuck to his guns, the all in may have just said you have over pair due to the initial raise, so thinks his 2 pair is still good,
But also he could hace had 9-10 so the all in was over the top, looks despriet aswell, guess you knew hed call so wait till the river comes then bet.
Hard to say yes or no, but yes lol. unlucky.

yea i wouldnt put u on a straight here either so i would have probably assumed my 2 pair was good too. That's the problem when u raise preflop with suited rags its hard for ppl to give u credit for anything on a 678 flop ESPECIALLY when they hit 2 pair on the same flop. So as those before me said unlucky for you but most ppl would agree thats a call he can make.

I would have folded - too much of a raise for a bluff - you cant expect all the time to hit your card on the river and if it didnt come you are a lot of cash down!

I think making it thirty to go on flop and firing a 70 Euro all in ( = pot size ) on turn is a perfect value bet.

Plus: it looks like one, and CANT be anything else. The only hand NOT beating him which MIGHT possibly do that is AA.

A8, QQ, JJ, 10 10, 99 wouldnt play it that way. Only KK and AA. KK has him beaten.

Why should the flushdraw, even A9 hearts, fire again on turn? It would probably check in position after the opponent has shown such vital interest on flop.

I´ll stick with it: I would even have folded a set there when the turn didnt bring a free pair.

really difficult call i would have prolly done similar or the same tactics as you he just hit a lucky card and that will happen there was nothing that couldve beat you when you bet so good call keep your head up

Your raise on the flop made it look AK with 1 Heart imo it looks like a bluff which in this case was good but your buddy got lucky. He will pay you off in this spot 9 out 10 times.

Yea I probably would. I'm not a very good player tho so who knows if you should. You probably shoudn't if I would haha. Have a good time in the poker rooms. Heart mitchell Aww crap!

I thnk the only mistake u did has been to raise 30$... if you had wanted him to leave a pot bet would have been enough to make him fold... while that big raise made him thinking about a bluff or a flush draw and when the 5th club didn't show at the turn he felt strong and pot committed so....

you got rolled playing a crap hand so serves you right,no offence but thats what happens when you go allin on 45 he could have been playing 95 so you still thankfull its all you had at the table,he was drawing to stronger hand,game over. Big Smile

that is such a bad beat i hope you get luckyer next time whas this a live game or on the internet ?
his changes where like 2 % that not good Worship Thumbs Up keep up the good work

ur utg raise is bad, should fold

flop is played well, turn too(maybe littlebit smaller bet, so that weaker hand will pay u off)

I would have snap called u aswell on the turn with his holdings, putting u on 99+ or maybe even AK

Posted by kuningas:
ur utg raise is bad, should fold

flop is played well, turn too(maybe littlebit smaller bet, so that weaker hand will pay u off)

I would have snap called u aswell on the turn with his holdings, putting u on 99+ or maybe even AK

Öhhhhm, okay, everything fine but the first sentence....

In a 6 handed (!!!!!) game ud never raise with suited connectors utg??? equal to co -2 in a full ring game?

I guess u are used to full ring games. Its absolutely necessary to switch gears from time to time and tighten and loosen up your raising requirements, so that people never know what ure holding.

Although I lost that hand, what do you think how many calls I would have found preflop if I would wait for AA /KK / AKs all evening????

Nothing is easier than robbing a Rock or a TAG player. Big Smile


How can his UTG raise be bad when you say you are willing to stack him off in this spot??("I would have snap called u aswell on turn...." Blink So it's bad play but he would take your stack....hmm Confused
I asume his UTG raise is to mix things up so you dont get too predictable + his buddy is on the SB so nothing wrong in getting tricky as long as 45 isn't standard range from UTG it's a brilliant play imo.

Raising suited connectors UTG is a borderline play. Even for shorthanded games. Most of the time you will be oop and have difficulties to control the size of the pot. And faced with a healthy 3bet you will be forced to fold most of the time. But against opponents who never reraise it is playable.

At NL100 where I play people tend to give UTG alot of respect when he opens and if called it's an easy hand to play though you are right a 3bet would destroy it and it's hard to get value OOP when you hit but once while i like to mix it up so my UTG range gets tricky for oponent+meta game. But 3betting suit connector IP is preferable Cool

i wouldnt have made that call
wouldn whant to risk all my money on 2 low pairs

I wouldve called with 2 pair:

Board: 6d 7h 8h Ks

equity win tie pots won pots tied
Hand 0: 40.909% 40.91% 00.00% 1764 0.00 { 87s }
Hand 1: 59.091% 59.09% 00.00% 2548 0.00 { KK+, 88-66, AhKh, AhQh, AhJh, AhTh, KhQh, KhJh, KhTh, T9s, 98s, 7h6h, 7s6s, 6h5h, 54s }

Even if I know you wouldnt double barrel with 2 overs+FD, pair+FD:

Board: 6d 7h 8h Ks

equity win tie pots won pots tied
Hand 0: 39.091% 39.09% 00.00% 774 0.00 { 87s }
Hand 1: 60.909% 60.91% 00.00% 1206 0.00 { KK+, 88-66, AhKh }

Edited by AdrienD (02 November 2008 @ 02:54 GMT)

shokaku, you make a very good post.

Well, you didn't say how stacked your opponent is here. If they have less than 60 in their stack, well, you have kinda priced them in. If they have 70 or more, well then they aren't getting the correct price to call, but it is close. So if they have a big stack and want to felt you, this could be an easy call. Also, they just called a 5X reraise on the flop for 30. That call should imply, they will call your last 70 allin. Or it implies it to me.

As already posted, your play looks very much like an overpair, or even a set, trying to protect the hand, or even a full blown bluff.

Also, that is not a lousy call, a loose call, sure, lousy no. Why, see the % in the above AdrienD post. Might be hard for them to put you on a made hand with the way you played.

If you are interested, here is why I think you didn't play the hand particularly well:

Preflop, you are raising UTG with 45c? Your justification, that it is 6handed and gotta mix up my game, sooted connectors, blah, blah, is just that a justification. 45s is about the worst sooted conns you can start with, and this hand is a good example why. Also, seems you have tried this move before, and the other players have picked up on this. Notice you got 2 callers, one with 87o! They have tagged you as super LAG, and seem to be fine with playing with you. You should pick up on this.

Flop. Well what have we here? You have flopped the arse end of the deal, hardly the nuts. There is a pot sized bet, and a call... Let me ask you, what card improves your hand? A 9? Actually no card improves your hand, so you have the arse end of the str. But you actually come screaming over the top with a 5X reraise. Sure, ok, trying to take it down there? You're betting 30 to win an 18 pot??? That is not the best play, imo. You don't have the nuts, and 2 people have put in a pot sized bet. Might be time to try and manage the size of the pot considering your meager holdings. This is NL, so you still have 2 more streets to stack off, er, I mean max your profit. Flat call here. Or reraise to 18. Try to manage the pot. The other thing is betting 30 here, leaves you with 70, and considering the size of the pot, you now have very little fold equity, and you have pretty much committed yourself to this pot.

Turn. I think you call this a blank. For ppK, that is not. But knowing the hole cards, that is... Regardless, had you flat called or even reraised to 18, IF they check to you here, you can make a value bet, that LOOKS like a value bet, and may be a tougher call, than the kamikaze allin. Or not.

What is that poker saying? Try to lose small pots and win big pots? Oh, I forget. You flat out overplayed this hand from the get go, and got unlucky at the end, to a 4 outer.

many things look strange here. why raising 45 from UTG if you know that you are plaing against a loose player? That's sick. Perhaps it's your stile... Well maybe he thought that you have K with good kicker 'cause he couldn't read straight here.

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