Joined: Feb '08
Location: Sweden
Age: 38 (M)
Posts: 7
We all know that the life of a pokerplayer. Glamour, champagne, private jets and long weekend at luxury hotels. Right?
I first came across onlinepoker a few years ago, not unlike many young Scandinavians during the big pokerboom.The pokermagazines where full of young kids, college drop-outs making dough, WPT and EPT became mainstream entertainment. When Chris Moneymaker won the WSOP Main Event 2003 the pro players shook their head in disbelief when he made some awful plays, but they knew. They knew that this was the best thing that would ever happen to poker. An Average Joe with limited pokerskills winning the largest pokertournament on the planet. And the name - Moneymaker. Could it get any more perfect?
Suddenly everyone was playing. Everone was dreaming of the big buck and so was I. I made money, I lost money, I read some books and won some more. You all know the story.
For a period I was on a serious downward spiral. Late night grinding. Going to work looking like Amy Whinehouse on detox. I won a substantial amounts of money, mainly via MTTs and lost it all playing cashgames. Okey, I figured, maybe I´m not as good a cashgame player as I though I was. And if thats the case, so be it. So I did the logic thing. I checked the stats, money going in and money going out, and thats when I realized. I realized the enormous amounts of rake being shipped to the sites. Ofcourse. The house takes a cut but I was beting the competion and still losing cash and thats a hard cookie to melt. Sure, live casinos also takes rake, even higher then the online ones. But think about the tempo and pace of online poker.And the possibility of multitabling. Millions and millions of hands played on a daily basis.
It became clear to me that it´s just not that easy. You don´t just read the books, play the odds and start making money. But thats what they tell you. The sponsored professional players, the TV advertisements with beautiful women and exotic beaches.
But what you don´t see is the, lets call it, unflattering side of the game; well-known poker pros being stakes for the major tournaments cause they can´t afford the entrance fee. Well-known poker pros going completely broke. But wait a minute here. A big shoot top of the food chain poker pro going broke, is that even possible? Didn´t they read the book? Didn´t they write the book?
But this little manifestation isn't about ludomania, rake and broke poker pros. Not entirely. It´s about a much larger perspective - the falsification of the entire poker industry.
Gambling can be a thrill. The adrenaline of winning a pot.The recreational home-game amongst friends. But the fact is that gambling is a depraved industry. An industry that prey on the weak - those with low impulse control, the compulsive gamblers. There is a reason there are legislations on gambling.That is a fact. What do I want then. Ban all gambling? Definitely not. We have alcoholics as well and and I don´t want to ban alcohol either. But the situation has spun out of control and the negative influence these giant international corporations has on everday situation for some people is just not acceptable.
People has always been suspicious of casinos, sure enough, they´ve gambled, undoubtably that is the case. But with casino you know, everybody knows, the most basic truism of casino gambling; the house always win, and the chances of beating the odds are slim to nothing.That is not the case with poker. Due to hyper-aggressive marketing by online poker corporations the truism of poker is rather; anyone can win anytime. And if you dont win your stupid. And your not stupid right?
In Sweden we have government gambling monopoly to avoid the negative consequences of gambling. I admit, I´m the first guy to get suspicious of government interfering with the free market. Today I know i was wrong. Since the online poker boom took Sweden by storm managing to surpass the legislation on gambling by offering their services through the internet, gambling addiction is now the new major public health issue. And this recent development has been "cross-breathed" with another depraved phenomenon in Sweden; short-term high interest SMS-loans. Young men, a majority with the ages 18-25 gamble their assets away and then go for these short-term loan and get themself in huge financial difficulties. And just imagine. Take your basic gambling addict, maybe a clerk at your local grocery store, its payday and hes just itching to hit the tables. Imagine him depositing 1000$ and losing that money the same day. that happens. That happens every single day. Thats one blind for Durrr and Ziigismund. Thats the rent and a month worth of food for the other guy. And it´s just so available. Its just a mouseclick away and for a guy with little or no impulse control that an awfully small mouseclick. And its another month to the next paycheck.
I have seen the evolution of poker and I dont like what i see.
Let me ask you a question. What is the value of a human life? I can answer that question for you. It´s worth about 28000$(200 000 swedish crowns). Or atleast thats what Christian Sellergren, Halmstad, Sweden though. November 3th 2007 Christian Sellergren became the first known pokerrelated death in Sweden at the tender age of 21. He he committed suicide not managing the shame or the pressure after losing loans of a mere 28000$. Half a buy-in for Tom Dwan and Phil Ivey, a years salery for Christian. A life for Christian.
But Tom Dwan and Phil Ivery will never go broke. Cause their good. And cause the poker corporations wont let them. They will throw them some crumbs if they need, sponsorchips and such. The mythology needs to stay intact if the dream wants to stay alive.
Which brings me to another important point.The ambassadeurs of poker. Sponsored pro players, self-proclaimed experts, pokerbook authors. These people need to take some moral resposibility. The dark side of poker need to be shown. These are the Baghdag Bob of poker.
Do you guys remember Baghdag Bob?. The Iraqi Information Minister in 2003 thatclaimed "everything is alright" and "the americans will surrender" whilst coalition tanks where patrolling the streets in the background.
I was watching an episode of European Poker Tour on Youtube the other night. I cant quite recall the location, somewhere in eastern Europe I believe."Huge turnout", the commentator shouted in astonished fashion. "A staggering 600 something", he keept going like a frantic actor on one of thoose cheesy infomercials trying load of "super exclusive" vacuum cleaners to unsuspecting consumers. The sidekick expert, a sponsored pokerpro seemingly, couldn´t wait to a agree in panegyric fashion; "Yeah, everybody´s making money these days", she shamelessly declared.
That really got me thinking. Is everybody really making that kind of money? On every given moment some hundreds of thousand players all over the globe are logged on to some kind pokerroom. And all these players are making it big. Right? These are the ambassadeurs of poker and they running arend for the big dogs, the faceless hypercapitalist behind the show.
Like Anurag Dikshit, Partygaming owner, and the 207th richest man on the face of the earth. And dont forget the colleague, Ruth Parasol, who started builing her fortune with pornographic websites. Classy.
People are so fast to spew their guts out when it comes to immoral Wall Street investors. Well spew your guts out now. The gambling corporation owners are the real capitalist-Lucifer, safely tucked away in a Caribbean tax-paradises and non-caring of any moral obligation.
Eastern Europe is the new market and Asia a potentially tremendous cash cow. I see the expansion of poker industry and it reminds me of a dystopian George Orwell reality. The fact is that onlinepoker is the most rigorous pyramid scam the world has even seen. The money is heading one way and one way only.
The pokersites are expanding and their not letting people go without a fight. They are predotorial and they are determined. Its bonuses with ridicoulus wagering deals and its rakeback. What? Rakeback? Are you giving me money back that you took away from me ? Why not just take less money from the beginning? Cause it´s all part of the illusion. The illusion of generosity and care for the said individual. A proper scam passed as a marketing tool.
This is not a declaration of war on poker. This is not a declaration of war on the free capitalistic market.
This is a declaration of war on the falsification of the pokerlifestyle, the in-your-face advertisement, the lies, the lack of responsibilty in the poker community and the shameless exploitation of gamblers, addicts and poker enthusiasts all over the world.
I see the Sheriff of Nottingham and theres no Robin Hood in sight.
This took me so damn long to write and its not even my native language. So pleased give some feedback and own thoughts.
Joined: Apr '09
Location: Australia
Age: 40 (M)
Posts: 6483
You're right in a sense. But it all comes down to what you said about alcoholics and not banning alcohol.
Take it from me, I was a serious gambling addict (slots/casino games) always losing my paycheck on pay day. I was also a serious drug user (meth/heroin/etc - IV). As a result I've relocated to my dads house which is in a little town of 150ppl without any means of gambling (other than online) and no access to drugs.
I do this to curb my tendancies, I still visit city and my gf lives there, I may hit up old vices sometimes when I do my visits, but these problems only really spiral out of control on when you do them every day. My break from city helps me.
Anyway, my point is, my addictions, gambling, drugs; these are not because of casinos, pokies venues, poker sites, drug dealers, etc. They are because of my own psyche, my own decisions. I am depressed and as such have a tendency towards masochism, which is often the thrill of betting your rent money (or injecting it) it's the thought that you do this and everything else fades away because you make life surreal when you know you've just spent the money you need to give to your landlord last week.
It's fucked up, but it's a cycle of destruction that has nothing to do with the symptons. If there was no gambling, no drugs, I'd find another way to dissasociate, believe me.
These problems are more fundamental, they're about individuals, about violence, bad childhoods, wars, politics, personal relationships, weight issues, etc. Sure, these gambling mobs may be seen to pray on these individuals and I'd certainly never run a casino myself. But my point is, these people would self-destruct regardless of the means. It doesn't help having the means readily available, but believe me, casinos, poker rooms, etc are NOT the cause of these behaviours, meerly an outlet for them.
On a side not, I find playing poker (for real money) actually helps my gambling addiction, I know longer feel compelled to play casino games/slots. I like poker, it stretches the budget a lot more (especially the value of a good MTT)
So in my mind, online poker rooms are actually SAVING me from a much more serious gambling affliction that I'd otherwise (still) have.
Joined: Feb '08
Location: Sweden
Age: 38 (M)
Posts: 7
I´m really sorry about the title Mr Klopmand. Silly me though a strong semipretentious title like that would get alot of readers. I didnt even consider the chance that any american on the forum would misinterpret the title "War of Declaration" to the american translation "International Conflict Solving". Poor you probobly went in thinking it was going to be a thread on securing oil assets in the Middle East and instead found the delusional rants of a precocious swedish pubescent. As you were probably already anticipating The Stars and the Stripes waving in the delicate breeze of the Persian Gulf you probably had a nice hard-on and an oilsoaked hand ready to get down to business and i spoiled the lovingtime leaving you with nothing but blueballs and a bad mood. I´m really sorry that happened and to show my good will please post your address and I will send you my entire subsciption of Guns and Ammo and some private pictures of me posing nude with a Kalasjnikov.
Joined: Sep '09
Location: Sweden
Age: 35 (M)
Posts: 1
really good post. i'm also from sweden and i relate to alot of what you're saying. these illusions that everybody makes money from online and offline poker are just sad. i had a friend who was up 40-50k $ at most. after 2 years the money was gone and he couldent stop playing.. begging friends for like 10$ coz he really thought he get back to the top with those 10$.
but is the problem really the gamling companys fault? i mean everyone wants to be rich, goodlocking and famous today.. and some might get fooled that poker is the way to get to your dreams. but most of us realise pretty fast poker is not the real income and joy in your life even though its really fun.
Joined: Feb '08
Location: Sweden
Age: 38 (M)
Posts: 7
Det stämmer absolut det du säger och jag har personligen kommit till insikt. Denna tråden rörde kanske oss svenskar på ett annat sätt eftersom marknadexploatering här i Sverige är helt abnorm. Det jag syftar på är inte att avskaffa det personliga ansvaret, men varför rapporteras det så okritisk. För några år sedan körde dem en följetong med Micke Turlitz under parollen Sveriges nya pokermiljonärer, men det faktum att han gulat x antal gångar tas inte upp lika kritiskt. När Glime, Leénard och alla självutnämnda pokerexperter snackar låter det ju som det är omöjligt att inte vinna pengar. Att gambla och spela poker är kul, inget snack om saken, men det är också en depraverad bransch som alltid har styrts av mafioso och nu ska man helt plötsligt göra den rumsren. Peace
Joined: Feb '08
Location: Sweden
Age: 38 (M)
Posts: 7
Thats spot on. I´m on the same page m8. The thing about poker though is that people "aint playing the house" so they cant loose if they play well. But they can sit there and grind all night and that rake will just keep nibbling on the bankroll. And then if you got the math you lack BR-management, theres just so many tools you need to possess. And people that completely rule out the luck-factor. I refer to it as luck metaforicly for circumstantial incidents, and those thing occur, favourably or otherwise. Ask any pro how you know when your a good player and the will answer - You make money. Ask them whose the best poker player ever and they will answer- Stu ungar Stu Ungar died broke. Peace
Joined: Mar '09
Location: United Kingdom
Age: 62 (M)
Posts: 86
you can always block the casino's/poker rooms on your pc . it is surely the individuals choice as to whether they play/deposit or not. sure the rooms make money THEY ARE IN IT FOR THE MONEY it is their businees to provide the likes of us the pleasure (pain), highs (lows), we crave as a release from the daily drudge of life.
Joined: Oct '08
Location: Germany
Age: 49 (M)
Posts: 2025
ok first off i had to google for Dikshit if that guy really exist - i think i could live with that name if i was a billionaire actually i dont know what your on about. we are all (not really) blessed with a brain and i quote palfco: its the individuals choice as to whether they play/deposit or not. the rakeback thing...the pokerrooms didnt invent it. if you think about then you will notice that its occure in any situation in your life.
