Joined: Feb '08
Location: Belgium
Age: 42 (M)
Posts: 58
ive raised the guy from the button for the 4 th time he tried to put a move on me earlyr but that didnt work and the i get this hand
Full Tilt Poker Game #11763912608: $3 + $0.30 Tournament (88117306), Table 41 - 25/50 - No Limit Hold'em - 9:43:55 ET - 2009/04/19 Seat 1: magrebijn (3,665) Seat 2: lisarich0812 (3,655) Seat 3: RiLeVa (2,480) Seat 4: Jotavious (3,320) Seat 5: K J Sage (2,160) Seat 6: polo2lille (3,340) lisarich0812 posts the small blind of 25 RiLeVa posts the big blind of 50 The button is in seat #1 *** HOLE CARDS *** Dealt to magrebijn [7d 7s] Jotavious folds K J Sage folds polo2lille folds magrebijn raises to 125 lisarich0812 folds RiLeVa calls 75 *** FLOP *** [2h Ks 6c] RiLeVa checks magrebijn bets 185 RiLeVa raises to 370 magrebijn calls 185 *** TURN *** [2h Ks 6c] RiLeVa bets 1,015 magrebijn has 15 seconds left to act magrebijn raises to 2,030 RiLeVa calls 970, and is all in magrebijn shows [7d 7s] RiLeVa shows [6h 8s] Uncalled bet of 45 returned to magrebijn *** RIVER *** [2h Ks 6c Kd] magrebijn shows two pair, Kings and Sevens RiLeVa shows two pair, Kings and Sixes magrebijn wins the pot (4,985) with two pair, Kings and Sevens RiLeVa is sitting out RiLeVa stands up *** SUMMARY *** Total pot 4,985 | Rake 0 Board: [2h Ks 6c Kd 2c] Seat 1: magrebijn (button) showed [7d 7s] and won (4,985) with two pair, Kings and Sevens Seat 2: lisarich0812 (small blind) folded before the Flop Seat 3: RiLeVa (big blind) showed [6h 8s] and lost with two pair, Kings and Sixes Seat 4: Jotavious didn't bet (folded) Seat 5: K J Sage didn't bet (folded) Seat 6: polo2lille didn't bet (folded)
not looking at the out come of the hand was his play just to strong to be trip Kings there or will i loose my chips 95% of the time
Joined: Aug '08
Location: Poland
Age: 39 (M)
Posts: 167
I think it was well played by magrebijn, you were on BB so little chance you got that king and in this case magrebijn was the "master". You had bad luck, I usually don't enter with like 6 & 8 cause than you can trap yourself like in this case. You had good hand after flop so you needed to finish it. Summarizing: bad play before the flop ( I wouldn't call that 75 even on BB)
Joined: Feb '08
Location: Belgium
Age: 42 (M)
Posts: 58
Posted by keram: I think it was well played by magrebijn, you were on BB so little chance you got that king and in this case magrebijn was the "master". You had bad luck, I usually don't enter with like 6 & 8 cause than you can trap yourself like in this case. You had good hand after flop so you needed to finish it. Summarizing: bad play before the flop ( I wouldn't call that 75 even on BB)
i think you misread it i was the one with 77 on the button and the bigblind called me with 6-8 I AM MAGREBIJN on fulltilt
Joined: Feb '08
Location: United Kingdom
Age: 37 (M)
Posts: 1886
When I first read it i was like what the hell are you doing. You should fold after he check-raised you on the flop. Then I see him make that massive bet on the turn and I think right you've got to fold. You raise all in. whoa. I think you played it very badly. Then I see his cards and think wtf. I guess you played it very well. Made an excellent read based on the situation. I have no idea how he called your raise all in.
I guess he thought you were just making moves on him. Always bullying his bb. And you guessed this was the situation. But from this hand alone I'd have said you played it badly had he showed triple Ks. I think he played it like he had K9 so I wouldn't have been surprised if you'd lost and then I would be saying you played it awful. Even though you called based on previous hands.
The correct raise preflop is four Big Blind + one after a dead money. So i think you had to raise to 200. if he calls my opinion is he do not have AKs AKo AQs AQo and pair in hand because if he have he tried to does all in pre flop. So you have a good flop if he raise you have to reraisae. The reraise is 3 raise, but if your reraise more then the half of your chips you have to go all in. I did this.
Joined: Apr '08
Location: Sweden
Age: 37 (M)
Posts: 188
There is no such thing as "correct bet sizes" while (4+1/Limp)BB is a decent bet it is always better to mix up your play with different bet sizes than to roboticly make the same raises all the time. I do however agree that it usually is a good idea to raise more with a hand like 77 pre flop and try to keep some pressure on your opponent, or simply just fold when you miss the flop or you will have no idea where you are in the hand.
Joined: Mar '08
Location: United Kingdom
Age: 46 (M)
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Yer you played it well, but I dont think you understood his intentions, but hey you had a hand outherwise he would have had you folding the flop, well thats my guess. After the turn its easy he made a bad bet and gave the game away, good call. Also you could say he did well to fire anouthe shoot at you, worth saying again I think if you didnt have PP to start it would have been his pot. As shokaku says its also player dependent. "not looking at the out come of the hand was his play just to strong to be trip Kings there or will i loose my chips 95% of the time" As shokaku says its also player dependent. Now you would need info to judge that, id say in most cases yes in this case yes(strong play), what would he expect you to be doing chasing what? no str8 no flush so yes it was / would have been bad play if he had it (k or PP for FH) Hope you catch my drift i dont explain well...
Joined: Feb '08
Location: Belgium
Age: 42 (M)
Posts: 58
Posted by awood88: When I first read it i was like what the hell are you doing. You should fold after he check-raised you on the flop. Then I see him make that massive bet on the turn and I think right you've got to fold. You raise all in. whoa. I think you played it very badly. Then I see his cards and think wtf. I guess you played it very well. Made an excellent read based on the situation. I have no idea how he called your raise all in.
I guess he thought you were just making moves on him. Always bullying his bb. And you guessed this was the situation. But from this hand alone I'd have said you played it badly had he showed triple Ks. I think he played it like he had K9 so I wouldn't have been surprised if you'd lost and then I would be saying you played it awful. Even though you called based on previous hands.
he checkraised me in hand before same sitiuation i had AK he was in the BB flop came A-10-3 rainbow i reraised all in and he instamucked. and like said it was the 4th time i raised his bigblind so i know he was getting sick of it and why i called the check raise is he could be doing that with any 2 i had position on him and wanted to see how the hand played out if the k didnt come on the turn and he would put out a bigbet i would probly fold but when the k did hit and he bet out pot so fast it seemed to me he wanted me to fold wich got me thinking if hes got trip kk why does he want me to fold
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Posted by pokersztar: The correct raise preflop is four Big Blind + one after a dead money. So i think you had to raise to 200. if he calls my opinion is he do not have AKs AKo AQs AQo and pair in hand because if he have he tried to does all in pre flop. So you have a good flop if he raise you have to reraisae. The reraise is 3 raise, but if your reraise more then the half of your chips you have to go all in. I did this.
on bet sizes i realy dont think i need to bet more with my stack size and the blinds where they are its early in the tournement and i dont want to steal the blinds 75 chips is not going to make me win the tournement i rather flop the 7 or get out of the hand with minimal losses a differnt strory if there were antes and bigger blinds then i would of raised more especialy from the button the whole theory of 3x the bigblind + 1 for every limper is more for cashgames if you paly alot of tournements you will realize that playin that way is almost impossible with the stacks you mostly have because if i have a 15 bb stack and there are 2 limpers with a AJ type of hand if i raise the i would automaticly need to go all in i cant raise 30% if my stack and then fold
Joined: Feb '08
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In that case you played it very well. As I said great read. My point was its hard to tell from this info from just this hand. It doesn't tell us how fast he bet. Your right that the bet on the turn looks weak but I may have figured it was meant to look weak. Turns out you made the correct play. The only thing I'd say is had he showed a K we'd now be looking at this hand very differently.
Joined: Feb '08
Location: Belgium
Age: 42 (M)
Posts: 58
Posted by awood88: In that case you played it very well. As I said great read. My point was its hard to tell from this info from just this hand. It doesn't tell us how fast he bet. Your right that the bet on the turn looks weak but I may have figured it was meant to look weak. Turns out you made the correct play. The only thing I'd say is had he showed a K we'd now be looking at this hand very differently.
thats why I put the sentence at the end
not looking at the out come of the hand was his play just to strong to be trip Kings there or will i loose my chips 95% of the time
Joined: Apr '08
Location: Sweden
Age: 37 (M)
Posts: 188
Well I can agree that middle and late stage tournament poker is very different from cash games, but this one is still in the early stages, so I do think that you should either put more pressure on your opponent with a hand like 77 or just fold it on the flopm on the turn I agree with you he doesn't play it like he hit the trips, but despite him being slightly likely to bluff at you with nothing the odds are imo far to high that he has a larger pair or the king. At this stage in a tournament I would just fold it and wait for a better opportunity, and even if you put him on a bluff I would raise him right there on the flop, 'cause while like in this instance you got a good card, another king there are too many scare cards in the deck and you can't really make that call hoping to draw out on him the 7's.
Joined: Feb '08
Location: Belgium
Age: 42 (M)
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Posted by Whiskerer: Well I can agree that middle and late stage tournament poker is very different from cash games, but this one is still in the early stages, so I do think that you should either put more pressure on your opponent with a hand like 77 or just fold it on the flopm on the turn I agree with you he doesn't play it like he hit the trips, but despite him being slightly likely to bluff at you with nothing the odds are imo far to high that he has a larger pair or the king. At this stage in a tournament I would just fold it and wait for a better opportunity, and even if you put him on a bluff I would raise him right there on the flop, 'cause while like in this instance you got a good card, another king there are too many scare cards in the deck and you can't really make that call hoping to draw out on him the 7's.
i do know that it was a borderline play but against any other opponent i would fold against the checkraise on the flop against this one tho it just smelled fishy i usualy play these pairs 95% for setvalue especialy this early
Joined: Apr '08
Location: Sweden
Age: 37 (M)
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Still I don't see the point in just calling on the flop, you have virtually no chance of making a stronger hand and practically any card that can come up will be pretty dangerous to you, so imo it's either raise or fold on that flop, regardless of your opponents play.
Dangerous hand but well played. Don't understand why oppo pushed so much with a pair of 6 and Kings in common. This bet has a sense just to scare you preflop but then...... Congratulations
