Joined: Jan '08
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Posted by gatorcountry: I have watched a few videos/documentaries on this subject with people trying to convince society thats 9/11 was setup by the goverment and well to tell you the truth it started to drive me crazy thinking about it because they gave some great points..Go to conspiracy reality tv.com and look for the 9/11 videos or go to the full list and watch the movie zeitgeist i believe thats how you spell but if you look you will know what im talking about but anyways what are some of your opinions
Search for this documentary, it is available and it is BBC4 production, not independent. Title is "The Century of the Self" http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0432232/ It has nothing to do with 9/11 itself but can explain why I don`t even have any desire entering into some philosophical discussion about anything deeper than what is presented in that documentary, no matter how good arguments I might have, usually it is pointless. All You will get are comments like the one from GabeKaplan.
About Zeitgeist. There are much better documentaries about 9/11 out there, Zeitgeist is not the best and certainly not most complete, it is Michael Moore duplicate when it comes to style and shallowness, in short another evening show. There are some lectures with even more information on everything, BUT you must understand one thing about all of them. Every single one of them, Joseph, Moore, Jones, Murdoch, Everard, Icke..., is egomaniac and not a single one of them gives objective view or true story about anything. They put something that is true and add crazy invention like the one from Icke, I`ll use him because its pure science fiction sometimes and Everard is not far behind at all (guess thats why they work together), about lizards ruling the earth (The Doors??? ). I can`t remember exactly was it in Zeitgeist or somewhere else where author pushed the theory that CIA used empty cargo planes with missiles and that all the passengers listed as killed were not on those airplanes at all.
Anyway, watch that documentary I mentioned earlier and let that information sit for a few days before you try to stamp it as true or false, only way to be objective about anything imo, and then do a little introspective on yourself, especially since you are american. Not intended as insult but necessity for most of the people except the ones living in poor and undeveloped countries and for people who like to do their own thinking rather than take someone elses. Give yourself some time, don`t rush and jump around, try to describe yourself as personality, to yourself of course. Go from there and try to follow timeline backwards in search for events in your life that were crucial/critical to make your personality the way it is today. It can be anything, from job loss, uncertain future to kindergarten period where you lost your favourite toy or when you first kissed a girl. Try to find were the steps you made in your life influenced by someone or something or were they your own. It can take a really long time till you get to the bottom but you will eventually. Believe me, no one including me, has been uninfluenced by marketing in some way and with other social mechanics at work believe me its a huge chunk of your life which you lived as bot. This may be crucial time for you americans to start thinking the other way, now when so many people are desperate, because those are the times when people start to look for answers on some questions which they were never bothered with before and looking for answers from certain individuals mentioned before is futile, they will just stall you until this phase of wealth transition is over and everything gets back to "normal" exploatation routine.
I must now go to my happy place . Sorry for the long one.
EDIT: or the comment like below . It`s hard to go against belief.
Edited by Administrator (22 January 2010 @ 09:27 GMT)
Joined: Jan '09
Location: New Zealand
Age: 36 (M)
Posts: 463
I don't think it's true. Taking out 2 towers and killing innocents as an excuse to invade 2 countries is not worth it. The cost of the 2 building and also the sudden stock market drop and the billions of dollars lost does not make up for having an excuse to invade another country. Both short term and long term of having a war and the occupation uses even more money and drains the economy..
This conspiricy theory s**t's never going to stop. Bottom line is the attack was real and the American gov't of the time used it as an opening to do a lot of shady practices for personal gain and to circumvent civil liberties (ie: Homeland Security).
Joined: Apr '09
Location: Australia
Age: 40 (M)
Posts: 6483
Posted by Predobar:
Posted by gatorcountry: I have watched a few videos/documentaries on this subject with people trying to convince society thats 9/11 was setup by the goverment and well to tell you the truth it started to drive me crazy thinking about it because they gave some great points..Go to conspiracy reality tv.com and look for the 9/11 videos or go to the full list and watch the movie zeitgeist i believe thats how you spell but if you look you will know what im talking about but anyways what are some of your opinions
Search for this documentary, it is available and it is BBC4 production, not independent. Title is "The Century of the Self" (http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0432232/) It has nothing to do with 9/11 itself but can explain why I don`t even have any desire entering into some philosophical discussion about anything deeper than what is presented in that documentary, no matter how good arguments I might have, usually it is pointless. All You will get are comments like the one from GabeKaplan.
About Zeitgeist. There are much better documentaries about 9/11 out there, Zeitgeist is not the best and certainly not most complete, it is Michael Moore duplicate when it comes to style and shallowness, in short another evening show. There are some lectures with even more information on everything, BUT you must understand one thing about all of them. Every single one of them, Joseph, Moore, Jones, Murdoch, Everard, Icke..., is egomaniac and not a single one of them gives objective view or true story about anything. They put something that is true and add crazy invention like the one from Icke, I`ll use him because its pure science fiction sometimes and Everard is not far behind at all (guess thats why they work together), about lizards ruling the earth (The Doors??? ). I can`t remember exactly was it in Zeitgeist or somewhere else where author pushed the theory that CIA used empty cargo planes with missiles and that all the passengers listed as killed were not on those airplanes at all.
Anyway, watch that documentary I mentioned earlier and let that information sit for a few days before you try to stamp it as true or false, only way to be objective about anything imo, and then do a little introspective on yourself, especially since you are american. Not intended as insult but necessity for most of the people except the ones living in poor and undeveloped countries and for people who like to do their own thinking rather than take someone elses. Give yourself some time, don`t rush and jump around, try to describe yourself as personality, to yourself of course. Go from there and try to follow timeline backwards in search for events in your life that were crucial/critical to make your personality the way it is today. It can be anything, from job loss, uncertain future to kindergarten period where you lost your favourite toy or when you first kissed a girl. Try to find were the steps you made in your life influenced by someone or something or were they your own. It can take a really long time till you get to the bottom but you will eventually. Believe me, no one including me, has been uninfluenced by marketing in some way and with other social mechanics at work believe me its a huge chunk of your life which you lived as bot. This may be crucial time for you americans to start thinking the other way, now when so many people are desperate, because those are the times when people start to look for answers on some questions which they were never bothered with before and looking for answers from certain individuals mentioned before is futile, they will just stall you until this phase of wealth transition is over and everything gets back to "normal" exploatation routine.
I must now go to my happy place . Sorry for the long one.
EDIT: or the comment like below . It`s hard to go against belief.
agree with this and century of self is definitely a good series to watch. Has a lot more substance than all the real hardcore Michael Moore types that just speak mostly BS.
Joined: Jan '08
Location: Germany
Age: 39 (M)
Posts: 84
Here are my two cents: I also have seen Zeitgeist 2 weeks ago. And I have to say that many people do a lot for ... nothing. I mean if it was Bin Laden who planed the attack (well Zeitgeist shows quite clearly that he did "not" have "anything" to do with it, but let us take this perspective). Alright this guy kills thousands of people just to tell the world USA is bad. Sounds stupid doesn't it? Now let us say that the profitmakers out of this planed it: The biggest profitmakers are the Federal Reserve Bank and the Carlyle Group (I do not know if this spelled correctly but everyone in the USA should know this company, don't you? AH yes bin laden also invested in this company so ...). OK just these two big companies made multiple billions of dollars of profit out of this s**t. This sounds horrible, but I am currently in poor country where people got killed just for $50 or less, so this sounds to me like a very plausible reason. A third perspective could be that an unknown group, country or person did it. But for which reason? I can not find any reason other than Ideological reasons could be that the USA treated someone bad, well they treated and are treating a lot of people bad, but than I guess the target would be a person that has something to do with the bad treatment and not some civils. I mean for ideological reasons I would never attack the WTC or pentagon, the only target for me would be the white house or especially the president, minister...
BUT THE BEST SCENE IN THIS DOCU ZEITGEIST IS WHEN BUSH USES IN A SPEACH EXACTLY THE SAME WORDS AS HITLER IN THE 30'S
Posted by tobik999: Here are my two cents: I also have seen Zeitgeist 2 weeks ago. And I have to say that many people do a lot for ... nothing. I mean if it was Bin Laden who planed the attack (well Zeitgeist shows quite clearly that he did "not" have "anything" to do with it, but let us take this perspective). Alright this guy kills thousands of people just to tell the world USA is bad. Sounds stupid doesn't it? Now let us say that the profitmakers out of this planed it: The biggest profitmakers are the Federal Reserve Bank and the Carlyle Group (I do not know if this spelled correctly but everyone in the USA should know this company, don't you? AH yes bin laden also invested in this company so ...). OK just these two big companies made multiple billions of dollars of profit out of this s**t. This sounds horrible, but I am currently in poor country where people got killed just for $50 or less, so this sounds to me like a very plausible reason. A third perspective could be that an unknown group, country or person did it. But for which reason? I can not find any reason other than Ideological reasons could be that the USA treated someone bad, well they treated and are treating a lot of people bad, but than I guess the target would be a person that has something to do with the bad treatment and not some civils. I mean for ideological reasons I would never attack the WTC or pentagon, the only target for me would be the white house or especially the president, minister...
BUT THE BEST SCENE IN THIS DOCU ZEITGEIST IS WHEN BUSH USES IN A SPEACH EXACTLY THE SAME WORDS AS HITLER IN THE 30'S
Your last statement brings up some history facts, Hitler was financed/backed by the Bushs' that enabled him to get as far as he did. As for the WTC, I'm surprised nobody has brought up the issue of controlled demolition with insurance fraud yet. Or if it was, it was mentioned in one of the long posts that I just breezed thru. Also, a lot of investigative material against some major corporations was in those buildings that were incinerated in the blasts. When the twin towers were built, plane crashes were a concern so it was designed to take at least 6 hits and still be standing.
i have also watched zeitgeist and similar documentaries and i have also nearly gone mad thinkin bout it. Maybe we are just enslaved by money maybe we are bein led around not knowing that we are just being kept in our boxes. I have settled on the idea that to inform the next generation and to enlighten this one is the only way forward. a worldwide revolution would not be healthy for mankind but the system does have to change. For our own sanity we have to remember that not every conspiracy theory is true (we did land on the moon), but their not all false either (wars have been started and kept going for profit, watch "the fog of war" . The world is not owned by humans we just live here but a few have convinced the masses that they own most of it and they are doing it with money which is invented by man. When money stops being a product in itself and when interest and inflation are abolished then i hope humans can realise that we are the keepers of this planet for the short time we are here and rayher than fighting over whose imaginatiopn has come up with the better god we should concentrate on the real things like nature, science and try to get rid of all the ancient religions(& some new ones). If we can rid the world of supersticion we will have done a lot for the advancement of all living things. I am not the weak, I am not the powerless,I am not the dead. I am the strong, I am the powerful, I am the living I AM THE PEOPLE
Radical religous people are not going to target a person cos they know only too well the power of a martyr They want to target the infidels and the society in which they live, and the structure which stands tall and proud in the financial hub of western society was the wtc. I dont know who planned it but it was definately a valid target for radical muslims.
Joined: Feb '09
Location: Canada
Age: 47 (M)
Posts: 241
If you have a true interest in the truth goto infowars.com Alex jones has made more than 15 movies on the subject all free for download on googlevideo. A good movie to start with is terror storm which covers the history of government sponsored terror and don't just take his word for it do some research yourself, you will find the world we ive in is much different than what you see. We are all SLAVES to the system always have been and always will be until people take their heads out of their asses and start reading and researching instead of just listening to mainstream media. We need more freethinkers in the world instead of a bunch of sheeple running around.
Joined: Mar '08
Location: United Kingdom
Age: 44 (M)
Posts: 6714
Truth, LOL, someone elses oppnion, thats the truth? Or is he just trying to make money of the back of it? No1, you upset the govenment spilling things you should not, rest asure you wont talk for long, However you can blabble about absolute rubbish. yes we are all slaves to the system, but you dont have to be, you can choose to go against it if you wish, so we are only self imprisond.
UFO Recovered at Roswell John F. Kennedy’s Assasination Global Warming Princess Diana was Murdered by the Royal Family Apollo Moon Landing Dinosauroid-like Alien Reptiles are dominating the World Barcodes are really intended to Control people U.S. military caused the 2004 Indian Ocean Tsunami Kentucky Fried Chicken makes black men impotent Fuel Farce Bible Evolution Barack Obama is bin laden Swine Flu Michael Jackson is on the moon with Elvis and 9/11 was Planned by the US Government. All rubbish. Possably im a freethinker or just a sheep, Im aware much more goes on in life that we are aware of, somethings we dont need to know, conspiracies will stay conspiracies as there is no fact behind them, and even when there is conspiracists will ignore it, so the truth can never win, conspiracists can not except the truth. The main conspiracy behind 911 is that it was done to invaid Afghanistan, the US is a superpower and will and always hve done what they like, if they were going to invaid they did not need this excuse, everyone knew it was going to happen, same goes for Iran just a matter of time.
Joined: Jan '10
Location: United States
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Posts: 123
Actually it wasnt the Us goverment that set all this up ..it was these Dudes that run the biggest banks in the world because in all actuality there the ones who run the world and they set this all up because whats the biggest way for a bank to make profit thats war..war generates the most profit for these banks how do you think the Us is 15 trillion dollars in debt
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Posted by trapdoor22: i have also watched zeitgeist and similar documentaries and i have also nearly gone mad thinkin bout it. Maybe we are just enslaved by money maybe we are bein led around not knowing that we are just being kept in our boxes. I have settled on the idea that to inform the next generation and to enlighten this one is the only way forward. a worldwide revolution would not be healthy for mankind but the system does have to change. For our own sanity we have to remember that not every conspiracy theory is true (we did land on the moon), but their not all false either (wars have been started and kept going for profit, watch "the fog of war" . The world is not owned by humans we just live here but a few have convinced the masses that they own most of it and they are doing it with money which is invented by man. When money stops being a product in itself and when interest and inflation are abolished then i hope humans can realise that we are the keepers of this planet for the short time we are here and rayher than fighting over whose imaginatiopn has come up with the better god we should concentrate on the real things like nature, science and try to get rid of all the ancient religions(& some new ones). If we can rid the world of supersticion we will have done a lot for the advancement of all living things. I am not the weak, I am not the powerless,I am not the dead. I am the strong, I am the powerful, I am the living I AM THE PEOPLE
Amen you put the words right into my mouth man post of the decade on here
Joined: Mar '08
Location: United Kingdom
Age: 44 (M)
Posts: 6714
Do you think honestly that the "owners" of the worlds banks got together and planned an operation with a guy who despises western ways? I give it more credit than the govenment theroy. When your a billionair do you need to do such a thing? Banks run by mini starlings? I agree they are meglomanias, thats for sure. But no, it was done and planned by Al Qaeda as admitted by Al Qaeda for our western ways, or revenge. It was notthing to do with religion and all that BS, The twin towers were not only functional centers of finance, they were iconic symbols of America’s mighty economic impact throughout the world, its about wealth. It’s about money. It’s about some people believing they are being exploited so badly that they and their way of life can’t survive, and how better to react than attack our way of life. SIMPLE.
Joined: Jan '08
Location: Germany
Age: 39 (M)
Posts: 84
So maybe it was not planned by the US Government but maybe supported. For example the thing with the passport of one of the terroristic airplane crew that was found (everything burnt down, they could not found humans, but a piece of paper?). When it was Al Qaeda and they wanted to destroy the iconic symbols of the US economy, why did "they attack" also the pentagon (well there is no info about this attack, just that the US government said they did do it)? The military killed a lot of afghan people while Bin Laden was in a US military hospital. You ask why they need to do something like a self-attack. Well US american people also can think and when in a war 1000s of americans die it is easier to understand when you say they died for our freedom instead of they died because we need to secure our oil sources or the finances of our biggest tax payers. Also you forgot the vietnam war in your list. A lot of US americans are still backing theirs self with this, but there was no reason for the USA to get into this war. Or the second world war: Russia was the country who fought the most, but the USA are making a lot of films about their heroes of the this war. And USA is the only country that acts against the contracts they signed with the four countries who helped the germans (they still have a lot of military bases in germany, but the countries said 50 years after this war they do not have any right to stay). There are a lot of histories where the USA are involved in that are not quite clear.
------------ @ih8usukouts: In the second world war every country (germany until a certain point, france, britain and obviously the usa) was financed by the Federal Reserve Bank (maybe russia not I am not sure). And the thing with the insurance fraud is something I also thought on myself shortly after this happened. Maybe this was the only possible way to demolish this expensive building and build something more economic.
Joined: Feb '08
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Posts: 751
i believe that everything is possible in life however that in this case it's politic and so dramatic that i do not even want to think about the truth .
). I can`t remember exactly was it in Zeitgeist or somewhere else where author pushed the theory that CIA used empty cargo planes with missiles and that all the passengers listed as killed were not on those airplanes at all. 
. Sorry for the long one.
Ideological reasons could be that the 
. The world is not owned by humans we just live here but a few have convinced the masses that they own most of it and they are doing it with money which is invented by man. When money stops being a product in itself and when interest and inflation are abolished then i hope humans can realise that we are the keepers of this planet for the short time we are here and rayher than fighting over whose imaginatiopn has come up with the better god we should concentrate on the real things like nature, science and try to get rid of all the ancient religions(& some new ones). If we can rid the world of supersticion we will have done a lot for the advancement of all living things. I am not the weak, I am not the powerless,I am not the dead. I am the strong, I am the powerful, I am the living I AM THE PEOPLE
