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  4-Feb-13, 20:30   #1
When to take a step up 0 
p0ck3tr0ck3t 
Joined: Jan '11
Location: United Kingdom
Age: 26 (M)
Posts: 704
So since i came back to online poker i have been playing micro stakes cashing a few times a day and doing quite well. when is the best time to step up to a higher stake?

p0ck3tr0ck3t

     
  4-Feb-13, 20:34   #2
  0 
Weenie 
Joined: Aug '12
Location: Slovakia
Age: 29 (M)
Posts: 680
I think If your bankroll will be more than 100 buy-ins on higher level, that should be enough to move on.. But I am lame, wait for somebody more skilled and experienced to answer your question correctly Big Smile

     
  4-Feb-13, 20:43   #3
  0 
Jibberish 

Joined: May '11
Location: Canada
Age: 26 (M)
Posts: 979
i usually play around 25-30 BI on cash tables, id perfer to have 55 before i step up then if i lose 5 i jump back down and grind another 5 to take another shot, but then again i often have a problem of deciding to jump many limits and play 3-4 BI like an idiot Thumbs Up

     
  4-Feb-13, 20:43   #4
  0 
pochui 

Joined: May '08
Location: Lithuania
Age: 32 (M)
Posts: 8648
Posted by Weenie:
wait for somebody more skilled and experienced to answer your question correctly Big Smile

that would be me Agree the answer is really simple- step up when you are beat the limits u'r playing at. move to higher limits, if u do sh1tty there, move back to the lower ones, study more- then have a crack at them again...or u can go take the "pro route" (my fav)- move to higher limits when u have 2 BI's...

     
  4-Feb-13, 20:53   #5
  0 
Jibberish 

Joined: May '11
Location: Canada
Age: 26 (M)
Posts: 979
a lot of deciding when to step up comes into the factor of asking yourself these questions. how much of an edge you had in the game u were playing, is the higher limit possibly more profitable(it isnt always), what type of game are you playing(SnG, MTT, Cash) and can your bankroll handle the jump, do you already own pokertracker or hold em manager, are you confident in your playing ability and wont become scared money, if you lose will you go back down limits without tilting and finally do you think you can beat the next limit?

     
  4-Feb-13, 23:40   #6
  0 
RoninHarper 

Joined: Nov '12
Location: Canada
Age: 48 (M)
Posts: 4440
G'day mate

It depends on weather you are talking about cash table or mtt's or sit n go's. each type of game has different requirements. No Limit holdem is not the same as limit or Omaha hi/lo. Every variant need slight different rations. Give us a dew details about your game then we can help more.

Ronin Cool Cool

     
  5-Feb-13, 00:15   #7
  0 
damosk 
Joined: Feb '11
Location: United Kingdom
Age: 52 (M)
Posts: 4873
Your bankroll is always the determiner of how much you spend on games, however there is a theory that I have which overrides this. If you have $100 and you would happily place it on a horse....then you may as well play a $100 buy in game. Thisis different to your bankroll management as it is disposable money that you ar happy to lose.

     
  5-Feb-13, 00:28   #8
  0 
KowKain 
Joined: Feb '11
Location: Slovenia
Age: 26 (M)
Posts: 109
I think you should jump stakes when money or buyins lost means nothing in the psycological point of view.
Sure there are some bankroll management rules, but personally I think it's more important that you have enough behind so it doesn't put you on tilt if you lose to a statistical improbability.

There's little difference in jumping micro stakes (except Pokerstars), but for bigger games someone else will have to tell you how and when. I'm just not there yet Smile

     
  5-Feb-13, 00:29   #9
  0 
marqis 

Joined: Sep '10
Location: Netherlands
Age: 48 (M)
Posts: 1631
Posted by damosk:
Your bankroll is always the determiner of how much you spend on games, however there is a theory that I have which overrides this. If you have $100 and you would happily place it on a horse....then you may as well play a $100 buy in game. Thisis different to your bankroll management as it is disposable money that you ar happy to lose.

Sure, but if your aiming to be winning player, it's very hard to recuperate losses that you occur while playing outside proper bankroll management, in levels you're not ready for.
Personally it would bother me, losing my whole bankroll this way, and starting over, at lower limits, where it takes forever to win it back, let alone building a new bankroll, before moving up again...

     
  5-Feb-13, 01:28   #10
  0 
nipitiri3 
Joined: Nov '11
Location: Estonia
Age: 32 (M)
Posts: 614
ya i moved higher limits too fast after had some succsess in micro tourneys was not good idea Big Smile
at higher buy in tourneys players play more other players not cards bluff at right places and so on it makes tourney much more difficult soo i better keep playing micros

i agree with jibberish text for me micros are better learned it hard way tho

     
  5-Feb-13, 05:30   #11
  0 
Mysik86 

Joined: Nov '11
Location: Poland
Age: 30 (M)
Posts: 773
It's good question about playing at higher stakes. But like other said: if you feel good and strong and have solid bankroll - you may enter higher level. But you always should know that higer stakes is always harder to play than lower...

     
  5-Feb-13, 11:50   #12
  0 
erru9107 
Joined: Oct '11
Location: Sweden
Age: 25 (M)
Posts: 910
It depends greatly on your bankroll. One of the most important skills to master is Bankroll Management. If you're afraid that moving up in levels could make you broke, then don't. when you feel that you have a sufficient amount of BI's to ensure not damaging your bankroll horribly if you lose one or two or even ten BI's, then you're good to go give it a try.

In CG, I play 20 BI. If I drop below 20, I go down in limits, when I'm at 20 again, I move up, simple as that. And I make a decent profit from those games. Although now I stay away from the CG tables since I'm trying to master the DoN SnG concept. I like those games but they just haven't been profitable for me in the past and since I back then relied on my poker winnings to have a social life (economy was very tight) I grinded the CG's. Now that I have a job and don't really need the poker winnings, I'll try to master the games I like instead of sucking it up and playing for profit Tongue

     
  5-Feb-13, 12:46   #13
  0 
bullettooth1 

Joined: Mar '11
Location: United Kingdom
Age: 32 (M)
Posts: 1635
A lot of talk about your bankroll being the main factor. but i would say it's down to your skill level.

If your a winning player at say NL10 and making a nice chunk of money why move upto NL25 if your going to be a break even player? Doesn't make alot of sense to me.
If you do want to take a shot I would say 50 buy ins should be your min. That's if you are making that jump but if your making the jump from NL4 to NL10 then a bit less would be OK as their isn't that much difference between the level of skill at these levels.
There is, however, a bigger jump between NL10 and NL25
Good luck Thumbs Up

Edited by bullettooth1 (Tuesday, February 05, 2013 @ 12:54 GMT)


     
  5-Feb-13, 13:45   #14
  0 
Zen1004 
Joined: Apr '12
Location: Korea, Republic of
Age: 54 (M)
Posts: 244
There are two basic factors to consider on when to move up a level.

The first factor is the size of your bankroll. Practice proper bankroll management and be prepared to move back down a level to rebuild your bankroll. When first moving up a level there may be a period of adjustment required until you become a winning player at the new level. You may find yourself moving up and down more than once.

The second factor is the state of play at your current level. Don't move up until you are winning regularly at that level by a significant margin. If your a marginally winning player, you have more to learn before you are ready to step up level.

     
  5-Feb-13, 16:03   #15
  0 
KowKain 
Joined: Feb '11
Location: Slovenia
Age: 26 (M)
Posts: 109
Posted by Zen1004:
There are two basic factors to consider on when to move up a level.

The first factor is the size of your bankroll. Practice proper bankroll management and be prepared to move back down a level to rebuild your bankroll. When first moving up a level there may be a period of adjustment required until you become a winning player at the new level. You may find yourself moving up and down more than once.

The second factor is the state of play at your current level. Don't move up until you are winning regularly at that level by a significant margin. If your a marginally winning player, you have more to learn before you are ready to step up level.



What does it mean to be "marginally" winning player? how much bb/100 over how many hands?

     
  5-Feb-13, 19:23   #16
  0 
Jibberish 

Joined: May '11
Location: Canada
Age: 26 (M)
Posts: 979
marginal would probably be like 5-10bb/100, usually if im not winning around 20-30 ill go back down limits

     
  5-Feb-13, 19:49   #17
  0 
BeMyATMplz 
Joined: Feb '11
Location: Germany
Age: 23 (M)
Posts: 1854
Posted by Jibberish:
marginal would probably be like 5-10bb/100, usually if im not winning around 20-30 ill go back down limits


Once you get a decent samplesize come back and write down again 10BB/100 is winning marginally.. 10BB/100 is more like crushing the stakes,and even at NL2 it would be at least "decent" Smile
30BB/100 not substainable no matter what stakes

     
  5-Feb-13, 20:13   #18
  0 
Jibberish 

Joined: May '11
Location: Canada
Age: 26 (M)
Posts: 979
Posted by BeMyATMplz:
Posted by Jibberish:
marginal would probably be like 5-10bb/100, usually if im not winning around 20-30 ill go back down limits


Once you get a decent samplesize come back and write down again 10BB/100 is winning marginally.. 10BB/100 is more like crushing the stakes,and even at NL2 it would be at least "decent" Smile
30BB/100 not substainable no matter what stakes



30bb is easy in micro stakes, everyone pays off the nut hand lol easy to stack someone for 100 BB in 5-6 orbits of 6max plo

     
  5-Feb-13, 20:24   #19
  0 
BeMyATMplz 
Joined: Feb '11
Location: Germany
Age: 23 (M)
Posts: 1854
Posted by Jibberish:
30bb is easy in micro stakes, everyone pays off the nut hand lol easy to stack someone for 100 BB in 5-6 orbits of 6max plo


Show me anyones 30BB/100 stats then over a decent sample (not anything less than 50K hands minimum),good luck finding one Blink
You are looking at it too simple,you cant just say/think "omg I if I stack someone once per 100 hands I have 100BB/100",its not as simple as that that you always win,you have to include the times you run bad as well,and thats why its important to have a good enough sample to determine results

     
  5-Feb-13, 20:40   #20
  0 
KowKain 
Joined: Feb '11
Location: Slovenia
Age: 26 (M)
Posts: 109
Guys, BB/100 is not the same as bb/100

First one means twice the second!


Well I grinded Pokerstars for the last year, getting 10bb/100 over 100k hands on NL2 and I'm pretty confident I crush these stakes.

Only reason I haven't moved up was due to broll imitations, wich should be resovled by the end of this month Smile
Plan to start playing NL4 with 200$ or so. Like to keep it on the safe side with 50 BI's

     
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