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  1-Dec-13, 14:41   #1
The Fish Schooling Effect 0 
Phisix 

Joined: May '13
Location: United Kingdom
Age: 30 (M)
Posts: 2216
Fish schooling. You know the type, when most of the fish on the table all start following each other calling any raise with any two cards after limping in and generally chasing and fishing everything. I have realized that when I encounter these types of tables odds get messed up and variance tends to be massively bad against me and of course trying to bluff is out of the question even when they have nothing. Is it best to just leave the table to avoid all that and the loss of money due to them always sucking out and stuff or stay because of course they are fish and you can make more out of them?

To be fair when there is one or two fish on the table I reap the rewards most of the time but when the table is filled with them raises, decent hands and position seem to be pointless due to the any two cards and chase syndrome which in turn I seem to lose more than I win. Maybe it is just me when I play against a table full. Hearing other peoples thoughts on this schooling matter would be good.

Edited by Phisix (Sunday, December 01, 2013 @ 14:45 GMT)


     
  1-Dec-13, 15:00   #2
  0 
RoninHarper 

Joined: Nov '12
Location: Canada
Age: 48 (M)
Posts: 4440
dude i live to be on that type of table.
there is money to be made.
I always seem to take my game up a notch to adjust to the feeding frenzy
best wishes to you
be cool

Ronin

     
  1-Dec-13, 15:19   #3
  0 
Phisix 

Joined: May '13
Location: United Kingdom
Age: 30 (M)
Posts: 2216
Then you must be lucky then because a table full of them hit big hands with utter rubbish and always chase and hit there draws even when the odds of calling is against them. Perhaps it is just me who cannot handle a whole table of them though.

     
  1-Dec-13, 15:28   #4
  0 
Heskor 
Joined: May '13
Location: Mauritius
Age: 25 (M)
Posts: 2659
I like those table a lot too, they are crazy s**t, just play tight and play your premiums aggressively and you should make money.

Tip would be to flat Pocket pairs, when you hit the set let them do everything, if they are a fish they gonna bluff you, go to showdown with bottom pair etc. You'll get the money most of the time. Also it could happens that there is one particular fish who is winning with mediocre hand as he is getting lucky and you might be tempted to play mediocre hands too.

Do not, just play tight if you do not get money in that table, there is always tomorrow!

     
  1-Dec-13, 15:42   #5
  0 
Phisix 

Joined: May '13
Location: United Kingdom
Age: 30 (M)
Posts: 2216
I do tend to open my ranges a bit further than usual with these types of player. Premiums as well as suited connectors, but it's when I get my hands cracked by someone with 10,2o or Q3s hitting two pair or something OOP when there is a massive before them which gets my goat.

Thanks for the advice though I will just tighten up or less and be more patient. Or if I get's too much just leave before I go on tilt.

     
  1-Dec-13, 16:15   #6
  0 
zeroster 

Joined: May '11
Location: United Kingdom
Age: 51 (M)
Posts: 1372
I have to agree with Phisix on this one. Two maybe three fish at a table is a wonderful thing any more than that though and you may as well just be rolling dice.

     
  1-Dec-13, 16:19   #7
  0 
Phisix 

Joined: May '13
Location: United Kingdom
Age: 30 (M)
Posts: 2216
Indeed. I prefer a combination and Tag's and fish, but I always seem to have trouble with a school of fish. The variance seems to be on there side even if I am ahead in most of the streets.

     
  1-Dec-13, 16:19   #8
  0 
noonlion 

Joined: Mar '12
Location: United Kingdom
Age: 32 (M)
Posts: 1277
Posted by RoninHarper:
dude i live to be on that type of table.
there is money to be made.
I always seem to take my game up a notch to adjust to the feeding frenzy
best wishes to you
be cool

Ronin


Ditto.

If there's a table like that I'm looking to get involved as much as possible to try and maximise my skill against weak opponents with large pots preflop. Perfect Smile

Don't run away from the river side, stay and fish awhile - it may take a while to land a fish but when you do the rewards are well worth it.

     
  1-Dec-13, 16:23   #9
  0 
DaCapo71 
Joined: Aug '10
Location: Germany
Age: 45 (M)
Posts: 1712
But the "fishes"are better than the manics. The players from the poker school are motivated and play a solid abc poker style. And with the time, with the expirience of the suckouts they change to the maniacs.

     
  1-Dec-13, 17:39   #10
  0 
djpremier 
Joined: Dec '10
Location: Finland
Age: 24 (M)
Posts: 419
You just have to adjust ... If you cannot adjust then you are not the better player Smile
If the table is full of passive fish, just take the maximum value when you hit and be cautious when they turn aggressive! And if there are overly aggro fishes, just let them take themselves to valuetown when you hit good and don't be scared of their aggression Smile

Even if the table is full of bad players you still have to play good against them ... Dont start playing bad just because everyone else is playing bad.. Stick to the best plan against either type of opponent and don't tilt if you lose a buy-in or two, you will surely win many of those in the hands to come Thumbs Up Thumbs Up

     
  1-Dec-13, 20:10   #11
  0 
Mober 
Joined: Mar '09
Location: Greece
Age: 39 (F)
Posts: 10045
Every one agrees that when there are many fishes in the game, there is nothing much you can do.
If its a tournament you will have to wait for some of them to get eliminated, otherwise in a ring game,
you just get off the specific table.

     
  1-Dec-13, 21:35   #12
  0 
Phisix 

Joined: May '13
Location: United Kingdom
Age: 30 (M)
Posts: 2216
I am not moaning about fishes in the game just when there is a table full off them. Without fishes we would not make much money, but a whole table of them can lose you more. For me anyway.

     
  1-Dec-13, 22:58   #13
  0 
stanjonhson 
Joined: Jun '13
Location: Bulgaria
Age: 25 (M)
Posts: 44
Hello guys! The point I stoped to play low limits is fishes Big Smile But the curious think I played 0.05/0.10 zoom table 9 - max at stars and I had JK spades. and about 9 dollars stack, somebody raised me with a 2.70 ok I paid and the floop was 10s 9c Jh. He raised me againd with a 4 dollars ( maybe less but I dont remebmer) and the turn was Qc . well we bot went allin and He show JJ (I was happy beacouze I would win about 23 dollars there was one short stack allin preflloop . And the river was 9s And he got fullhouse . This hand made me reaaallly sick. I tilt now. Lost almost 10 $ in 20 sec Big Smile Then maybe I will deposit more and play at less 1/2 $ cas tables . ( anyway I preffer Mtt) And if anybody can tell me which limmits is no fish at all , or at least small number of fishes. Aww crap! Aww crap! Aww crap!

     
  1-Dec-13, 23:25   #14
  0 
Plexo 
Joined: Aug '09
Location: Chile
Age: 30 (M)
Posts: 1336
Posted by djpremier:
You just have to adjust ... If you cannot adjust then you are not the better player Smile
If the table is full of passive fish, just take the maximum value when you hit and be cautious when they turn aggressive! And if there are overly aggro fishes, just let them take themselves to valuetown when you hit good and don't be scared of their aggression Smile

Even if the table is full of bad players you still have to play good against them ... Dont start playing bad just because everyone else is playing bad.. Stick to the best plan against either type of opponent and don't tilt if you lose a buy-in or two, you will surely win many of those in the hands to come Thumbs Up Thumbs Up



I think you have the right point. Blink Blink

Just adjust your game and bet harder when u got a really good hand (2 pair or over).
If noobs are calling evertyhing , just do less Cbet ot control de pot if you think that your cards have some showdown value.

GL all!


     
  2-Dec-13, 09:20   #15
  0 
Zen1004 
Joined: Apr '12
Location: Korea, Republic of
Age: 54 (M)
Posts: 244
Posted by zeroster:
I have to agree with Phisix on this one. Two maybe three fish at a table is a wonderful thing any more than that though and you may as well just be rolling dice.



A lot does depend on how aggressive the fish are. If they are mostly "Calling Stations" it really doesn't matter how many of them are on the table. However more than one "Aggro Donk" on a table will result in a succession of hands that are either "All In" or "Fold" until the "Aggro Donks 'get weeded out. If you end up on a table with 2 or more of them that have been on lucky streaks on prior tables that will take a while.

     
  2-Dec-13, 11:18   #16
  0 
doubletop777 
Joined: Mar '11
Location: United Kingdom
Age: 47 (M)
Posts: 5557
Too many fish really spoil the table and i think it is best to leave and let them get on with it. One or two fishes on a table is always the best option, any more than that and i would just leave. Good luck to you on whatever you decide

     
  2-Dec-13, 11:34   #17
  0 
Theapple 

Joined: Sep '13
Location: Bosnia and Herzegovina
Age: 29 (M)
Posts: 1552
i also hate tables with more than 1-2 fishes lol.

just now i busted out of mtt, and tilted a bit after losing to 82 Spade Heart with KK. It wouldnt be that bad if it wasnt all in and he didnt get straight on the river though Big Smile Agree

but hey thats poker for u Evil

edit: learned long time ago not to bluff them, because it just doesnt work so just play top of ur tighest range when at table with many fishes (and u cant just leave because its mtt lol). sometimes it works, and other times... u bust out vs 82o Tongue

     
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