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  5-Mar-15, 00:51   #1
Not sure about this hand 0 
erru9107 
Joined: Oct '11
Location: Sweden
Age: 25 (M)
Posts: 910
My HH is originally written in Swedish so I've just translated it as good as possible.



Samdoggie222 (10,06 $)
OMG_Logan (5,65 $)
n_seymour (2,72 $)
erru9107 (8,25 $)
coinus (5,23 $)
manben88 (6,88 $)

ANTE/BLIND;
n_seymour post small blind 0,02 $, erru9107 post big blind 0,04 $.

DEAL
erru9107 is dealt [QD, 9C]

PREFLOP;
OMG_Logan folds
n_seymour folds
coinus calls 0,04 $
Samdoggie222 folds
OMG_Logan folds
manben88 calls 0,04 $
n_seymour folds
erru9107 checks

FLOP; [7C, 8D, 6D]
erru9107 bet 0,04 $
coinus call 0,04 $
manben88 raise to 0,22 $
erru9107 call 0,18 $
coinus fold

TURN; [7C, 8D, 6D, 5H]
erru9107 check
manben88 bet 0,44 $
erru9107 call 0,44 $

RIVER; [7C, 8D, 6D, 5H, AS]
erru9107 check
manben88 bet 6,18 $ and is all-in
erru9107 fold

Wrap Up
manben88 wins 1,43 $ from the main pot

End
Dealer: manben88
Main pot : 1,43 $
Rake: 0,06 $
Samdoggie222 loes 0,00 $
OMG_Logan loses 0,00 $
n_seymour loses -0,02 $
erru9107 loses -0,70 $
coinus loses -0,08 $
manben88 wins 0,73 $




Now, should I have called there or not? The villain has been known to overbet the river when he has the nuts to give the impression of a weaker hand and a bluff/semi-bluff. So my reasoning is that he was sitting on 9T and I just didn't think that my hand was good enough to call with.

Keep in mind that this is FastForward and the maximum BI is $5 so to call him would essentially mean risking over 1 BI on a hand that I wasn't confident enough to win.

My question to you, would you have called that bet? I was thinking about folding already in the turn but I was hoping that he wouldn't bet that much in the river to make it more possible for me to call him. So what's your take on this? Any input is greatly appriciated!

Edited by erru9107 (Thursday, March 05, 2015 @ 00:54 GMT)


     
  5-Mar-15, 00:55   #2
  0 
arsenej1 

Joined: Mar '09
Location: Canada
Age: 28 (M)
Posts: 3021
I must be blind i cant seem to see what u were holding?

------------
Nm i donno how i missed it lol

     
  5-Mar-15, 00:57   #3
  0 
StheP 

Joined: Oct '14
Location: Serbia
Age: 26 (M)
Posts: 3127
First I dont see your cards to tell anything O.o

     
  5-Mar-15, 00:57   #4
  0 
arsenej1 

Joined: Mar '09
Location: Canada
Age: 28 (M)
Posts: 3021
I probably would have called n took the lose/win eather he had it or he didnt.

------------
He got q9 i missed it too lol

     
  5-Mar-15, 00:58   #5
  0 
StheP 

Joined: Oct '14
Location: Serbia
Age: 26 (M)
Posts: 3127
Posted by arsenej1:
I must be blind i cant seem to see what u were holding?

------------
Nm i donno how i missed it lol

he edited it Blink

------------
My opinion: he hit nut flush drow on flop, and play it agresive... he put you on single pair, so when he sow that ace on river that he got, he decidet to raise all in... I think that is and there is maybe this one he got A8, which is also very posible... I am sure he doesnt have 910.. and I think you should call it... But also I dont know how he played before to tell for sure...

Edited by StheP (Thursday, March 05, 2015 @ 01:03 GMT)


     
  5-Mar-15, 01:06   #6
  0 
arsenej1 

Joined: Mar '09
Location: Canada
Age: 28 (M)
Posts: 3021
Thats what id say...busted flush maybe trips or two pair but doubt 910 unless it was his flush draw cards. ...probably busted flush n couldnt let go so he pushed to try n ween u putta the pot

     
  5-Mar-15, 01:21   #7
  0 
erru9107 
Joined: Oct '11
Location: Sweden
Age: 25 (M)
Posts: 910
I had to edit the post, I must have accidently erased my hand when I translated the HH Tongue

You might be right about that flush draw. If I didn't have any read on him from before I would have called. But the fact that I actually took some time to make a note on him that said he usually plays the nuts really aggressive and overbets the river tells me that it's a big possibility that he actually called with 9T preflop.

I might have missed a good payout but since I had that note on him, I'd rather play it safe. There'll be better spots to take home monster pots.

     
  5-Mar-15, 02:55   #8
  0 
pinotte 
Joined: Jun '13
Location: Canada
Age: 73 (M)
Posts: 3499
There are a lot of maybe in that hand, you had a straight but not nuts, he raised preflop would he had with 9 10s if yes he is a real loose canon.

I would have put him on a pocket pair i think it make more cense and maybe it a set.

However like you said you were not ready to take the risk of losing a big pot in this case your fold is good.

You will never know the end of the story. Big Smile Big Smile

     
  5-Mar-15, 09:21   #9
  0 
yout85 
Joined: May '12
Location: United Kingdom
Age: 31 (M)
Posts: 2016
I think the way you played it was fine... I also think the most likely holding he had was indeed 9 10... and a 9 at the very least.. With his river bet being 5 times the size of the pot, calling for a chop is a risky move... risking $6 to win back $0.60 - this would only be a good move if there was a less than 10% chance he was holding 9 10... which just isn't the case.

The move that made all the difference to that hand was the min-bet on the flop... Because of that, all subsequent bets were larger than they would have been - ending up with the all in which wouldn't have happened I believe if you check/call the flop.

The likelihood is that villain would have bet ~$0.06 on the flop, ~$0.16 on the turn... making the pot $0.52 going to the river - He would have to put you on a flush draw and would be unlikely to shove all in, meaning you could go to a showdown for a lot cheaper.

     
  5-Mar-15, 14:26   #10
  0 
Skpmorita 
Joined: Feb '14
Location: Tunisia
Age: 28 (M)
Posts: 2076
people saying good fold
i would call in seconds
maybe that is why i am a fish

if he had 9-10 .. that turn was the perfect card for him
if i were the villain , i would be thinking if he had straight draw , he might got there
or a flush draw didnt hit
so i would bet more on the turn .. not less than pot bet like he did
protect my hand against flush draws plus erru called a raise on the flop so he is sticking till the river

my bet would be busted flush draw turned to a 2 pair on the river or a nine in his hand
cant see him having 9-10

     
  5-Mar-15, 14:46   #11
  0 
yout85 
Joined: May '12
Location: United Kingdom
Age: 31 (M)
Posts: 2016
Have to disagree skp... I just can't see it being a +ev call long term.

$7.68 in the pot, $6.18 to call - meaning you would have to be correct over 80% of the time to be +ev.

If you call and win you would actually win around $0.30 less than the $7.68 due to the increased rake... making it closer to 85% you have to be right.

If you call and split you would end up losing money because of the rake.

So if villain has a 9, you lose... if they have 9 10, you lose big... The only thing you beat here is a stone wall bluff, or a set... and it's foolhardy at best to massively overbet a pot with a set when there are 4 to a straight on the board.

I would've folded without a second thought.

     
  5-Mar-15, 15:41   #12
  0 
Skpmorita 
Joined: Feb '14
Location: Tunisia
Age: 28 (M)
Posts: 2076
you convinced me
calculating the odds was spot on
but in those micro stakes , anything is possible
that is why folding 2nd nuts is harder for me
i wouldnt be surprised if he just pushed with a four thinking it is good

     
  5-Mar-15, 16:26   #13
  0 
leno1 
Joined: Oct '14
Location: Germany
Age: 34 (M)
Posts: 428
I would have called most definitely in this case, because you are holding the second nuts and only a single hand can beat you. If you have really had the impression, that villan had it its possible to fold, but its so unlikely.

     
  5-Mar-15, 17:33   #14
  0 
erru9107 
Joined: Oct '11
Location: Sweden
Age: 25 (M)
Posts: 910
Thanks for all your feedback! I'm sticking to my fold, I think it was the best move there. Especially sine the villain had the note on him saying that he liked to really overbet the river with the nuts.

     
  17-Mar-15, 17:26   #15
  0 
leno1 
Joined: Oct '14
Location: Germany
Age: 34 (M)
Posts: 428
Posted by erru9107:
Thanks for all your feedback! I'm sticking to my fold, I think it was the best move there. Especially sine the villain had the note on him saying that he liked to really overbet the river with the nuts.


If you are still thinking the fold was the best move here I wont blame you for it and taking notes and acting according to them is always a good thing. But still you have the second best hand possible and I would not give it up.

     
  17-Mar-15, 18:00   #16
  0 
TheMachineQC 

Joined: Apr '10
Location: Canada
Age: 27 (M)
Posts: 2126
I think you possibly did two mistakes in this hand.

First and most important: calling the 22 cents on the flop. It was a pretty large bet and you are aware that you are not drawing to the nuts. So why chase? I'd rather fold or raise in this spot and see what information my opponent gives me. But the minimum bet was also pretty bad so it was hard for you to rep a real hand here.

Second: Folding on the river. If you're chasing a straight and you hit it and there's no flush out there, don't fold. Or don't chase it in the first place Blink Stay consistant and logical with your own decisions!

(he could easily have low straight or a 9 just like you and you would split the pot, he could also be trying to turn a made hand into a bluff)

Edited by TheMachineQC (Tuesday, March 17, 2015 @ 18:04 GMT)


     
  17-Mar-15, 20:24   #17
  0 
superthight 

Joined: Jan '13
Location: Philippines
Age: 50 (F)
Posts: 752
u can choose what u want ,but then always remember the basic principle of poker before acting a move.bluffing is not profitable u could only win once but the rest of games are full of suffering loss.nice hand waysss...

     
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