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  7-Aug-18, 18:06   #1
PokerStars fraud? 0 
notek 

Joined: Nov '11
Location: Serbia
Age: 42 (M)
Posts: 3
Have you known that your money isn't secure on PokerStars?
Couple days ago, I received e-mail started like this: "Following a routine Security review, we identified an unusual attempt to access your account. This attempt came from an unfamiliar location or device and as such, we have added a new Stars PIN to your account as a precautionary measure..."
They gave me Stars Pin and I went to check it out. Surprise, surprise!!! I was left with $0, no suspicious transactions in the history, but still 0. Of course, I instantly sent e-mail to PokerStars asking for help. They've sent me User audit and I knew in that same moment what happened. Someone figured out my password, logged in, sit on the zoom max 2 ($3-$6) seats and sent money to someone/themselves.
I've never played on this kind of tables for the past 10 years. For the love of God, even PokerStars knew that it wasn't me. Why would they send me pin if they didn't find it suspicious? So, I wanted to know is there a chance to be compensated for this kind of loss, but answer was (long story short): "No way, your fault! You are responsible for you password! You gave it away."
Let's imagine for a moment that it was credit card and someone from Hong Kong took all of my money from it. My bank knows that I am at that particular moment at the other side of the world and it is quite obvious that it couldn't be me, but regardless they say: "Not our problem!" Really?
Epilogue:
PokerStars has frozen my account and asked of me to prove my identity. I have to prove who I am now? NOW and for what? For $0? Do they really think that I'll deposit my money again there? They are out of their minds if they think that I will build my bankroll again and let them be irresponsible for it!
So, if you have any money there, I'm suggesting that you think twice about will it wait for you in the morning?

     
  7-Aug-18, 19:10   #2
  0 
CALICUL 
Joined: Jan '14
Location: Romania
Age: 39 (M)
Posts: 2302
I suggest you to approach a clear explanation and to ask how it was possible because you have not logged in to pokerstars to transfer money. They have to do the research and to see where the money was sent. I do not think pokerstars steal money. They would lose much credibility and it's like committing suicide. Speak with moderators. Good luck.

     
  7-Aug-18, 19:47   #3
  0 
notek 

Joined: Nov '11
Location: Serbia
Age: 42 (M)
Posts: 3
I see now that the word "Poker Stars" is missing in the text, but I don't know how to correct the post. I assume it is little confusing thanks to that. Shorter version: There wasn't any transfer from one account to another, but in the hands history that I've received from Poker Stars, someone from my account gave all money to user named "rydujasa" in 2 hands. He played 5 hands total (3 folded and 2 simple lost) and it lasted less then one minute. Poker Stars figured out that it was't me, but they don't want to accept their responsibility for this case.

     
  7-Aug-18, 20:03   #4
  0 
CALICUL 
Joined: Jan '14
Location: Romania
Age: 39 (M)
Posts: 2302
If they do not take responsibility, it means that they do not even know what really happened. In this case they do not want to show interest to help you. Is a bad decision for Pokerstars because it is not normal. They should to helped you but they do not want it. I'm sorry for you. You have to listen other opinions in this site in the next days maybe you'll solve this problem.

     
  7-Aug-18, 22:58   #5
  0 
erru9107 
Joined: Oct '11
Location: Sweden
Age: 27 (M)
Posts: 1083
I get what you're saying. Not to be a d!ck but I also get what Poker Stars are saying. Most likely the people who did this has already cashout out that money meaning it's all gone and they have no way to transfer it back to you. Their only other option would be to pay you from their own pockets but if they do so, they could eventually go bankrupt since it would be just too easy for some people to orcastrate this type of thing. I mean, who doesn't already have, or could easily get, contacts on the other side of the planet, or at least very very far away. Just talk to that person, deposit cash to your account and play for a short time, then log out, wait 30 minutes and let your contact 10 hours away log in, which makes sure it wasn't you, throw away your money to his account, cash out from his account, get PS to refund you and split the "profit" between you.

Basically, I get where they're coming from, even tho it is a really terrible situation for you and I really feel sorry for you. All I can do is hope that PS finds a way to get your money back to you and I wish you the best of luck!

     
  8-Aug-18, 00:55   #6
  +1 
vic75 
Joined: Sep '10
Location: Canada
Age: 39 (M)
Posts: 2242
I had someone try to access my account from India last year good that i didn't have any bankroll and now I have to enter a pin with password to login. This is a tough problem to solve Poker stars should freeze and investigate player "rydujasa" account and return your money unless it is already gambled away or cashed out indeed a very complicated situation. I highly doubt that this is an inside job with Poker Stars probably just some hacker.

Edited by vic75 (Wednesday, August 08, 2018 @ 01:09 GMT)


     
  8-Aug-18, 04:39   #7
  0 
dirkemans 
Joined: Apr '10
Location: Netherlands
Age: 42 (M)
Posts: 30
Decent online corporations will immediately flag login attempts from unlikely countries..especially if there are wrong password attempts previously..really weird!

They also could at least start an investigation, the same kind of research they do when they suspect player ring fraude - now on a much smaler scale (only check the tables you played since the login from another country, until you logged in from your own country) to see who's the possible culprit...

You definitely should not let this go easily..

How much money did they steal?

     
  9-Aug-18, 01:35   #8
  0 
Tony_MON7ANA 

Joined: Mar '14
Location: Japan
Age: 44 (M)
Posts: 7961
notek, this is an interesting topic.
I guess you guys remember the online poker operator "DuckPoker," which went out of business? That operator was notorious. There have been numerous complaints about "DuckPoker."

Edited by Tony_MON7ANA (Thursday, August 09, 2018 @ 01:45 GMT)


     
  9-Aug-18, 08:49   #9
  0 
T3ddyKGB 

Joined: Oct '08
Location: Germany
Age: 43 (M)
Posts: 1997
Posted by notek:
someone from my account gave all money to user named "rydujasa" in 2 hands. He played 5 hands total (3 folded and 2 simple lost) and it lasted less then one minute.


all your money in 2 hands? Big Smile jeez, i was thinking you lost a huge amount, but in 2 hands... cant be that much lol. i always suggest to withdraw to your ewallet as soon as you make some higher winnings, but in this case.. its unfortunate what happend to you (or probably careless use of you), but what do you expect them to do?


------------
Posted by Tony_MON7ANA:
notek, this is an interesting topic.
I guess you guys remember the online poker operator "DuckPoker," which went out of business? That operator was notorious. There have been numerous complaints about "DuckPoker."


your not gonna compare duckpoker with PS.. Confused i dont play there anymore, but i still think poker stars is a serious and very trustful pokerprovider.

Edited by T3ddyKGB (Thursday, August 09, 2018 @ 08:53 GMT)


     
  9-Aug-18, 13:21   #10
  +2 
notek 

Joined: Nov '11
Location: Serbia
Age: 42 (M)
Posts: 3
Ok, guys, I can tell you've been focusing on the wrong question here. What does it matter have I lost $20 or $20000? Smaller amount makes bigger shame on them, if you ask me. I liked to play from time to time and I do it for fun. I am not good enough to make a career as a poker player, but I liked to play cash, tournaments and sometimes spin&goes. So, I haven't been a daily player for quite some time now. Maybe this was an explanation why I wasn't suited to be helped.
Regardless, the real issue here is that they've allowed this to happen. Why haven't we been protected? Why was I given pin after I was robbed and not before? How come they have even allowed someone to log in from unknown device and IP address? When I've pointed it to them, they've sent me bunch of mumbo-jubmo b.s., followed with their terms of use. They simply didn't want to go further with this question and they told me (in very nice, but irritated way) to F.off. The last drop in the glass full of water was when they have frozen my account under all these circumstances and asked of me to confirm my identity. How come they didn't ask me to do that when I had deposited money or maybe during the robbery of my account? They could ask that person to prove he was me... They treated me as a criminal, not as a victim. I have strong beliefs that they are responsible for the safety that their software should provided.
When it comes to Duck Poker, I have no idea, I haven't been playing there. I've never liked their interface (how shallow of me, right? not playing there because I didn't like how it looks and it apparently had much better arguments for not to play). I was playing on Party poker for a while where I made my $200 from 0. I moved that money on Poker Stars and that was obviously mistake that I won't make twice.

     
  9-Aug-18, 13:39   #11
  0 
Tony_MON7ANA 

Joined: Mar '14
Location: Japan
Age: 44 (M)
Posts: 7961
Posted by T3ddyKGB:
Posted by Tony_MON7ANA:
notek, this is an interesting topic.
I guess you guys remember the online poker operator "DuckPoker," which went out of business? That operator was notorious. There have been numerous complaints about "DuckPoker."

your not gonna compare duckpoker with PS.. i dont play there anymore, but i still think poker stars is a serious and very trustful pokerprovider.

I actually wasn't comparing DuckPoker with any other online poker operators.
I apologize for any confusion that may have caused.

     
  9-Aug-18, 18:47   #12
  0 
T3ddyKGB 

Joined: Oct '08
Location: Germany
Age: 43 (M)
Posts: 1997
Posted by notek:
Ok, guys, I can tell you've been focusing on the wrong question here. What does it matter have I lost $20 or $20000? Smaller amount makes bigger shame on them, if you ask me. I liked to play from time to time and I do it for fun. I am not good enough to make a career as a poker player, but I liked to play cash, tournaments and sometimes spin&goes. So, I haven't been a daily player for quite some time now. Maybe this was an explanation why I wasn't suited to be helped.
Regardless, the real issue here is that they've allowed this to happen. Why haven't we been protected? Why was I given pin after I was robbed and not before? How come they have even allowed someone to log in from unknown device and IP address? When I've pointed it to them, they've sent me bunch of mumbo-jubmo b.s., followed with their terms of use. They simply didn't want to go further with this question and they told me (in very nice, but irritated way) to F.off. The last drop in the glass full of water was when they have frozen my account under all these circumstances and asked of me to confirm my identity. How come they didn't ask me to do that when I had deposited money or maybe during the robbery of my account? They could ask that person to prove he was me... They treated me as a criminal, not as a victim. I have strong beliefs that they are responsible for the safety that their software should provided.
When it comes to Duck Poker, I have no idea, I haven't been playing there. I've never liked their interface (how shallow of me, right? not playing there because I didn't like how it looks and it apparently had much better arguments for not to play). I was playing on Party poker for a while where I made my $200 from 0. I moved that money on Poker Stars and that was obviously mistake that I won't make twice.


your right. it doesnt matter what amount has been stolen - robbery is robbery. i understand your anger, its just.. PS hasnt stored all the customers passwords in a box, and now it has been stolen by some evil guy. its mostly someones own fault if this happens (careless internet use). your not gonna get a compensate if this happens to your bankaccount. sadly, but mostly the money is lost.
its been a while but if i recall you could set (beside the pw) a pin and some other security things on your own.



     
  10-Aug-18, 06:21   #13
  +1 
Mysik86 

Joined: Nov '11
Location: Poland
Age: 32 (M)
Posts: 978
This is internet fraud, and because I'm IT specialist, I don't know why PS don't do following things:

- track IP of the computer, which steal your cash? It's simple and remember that PS track multi-account on IP/MAC address!
- ban user rydujasa until they solve whole situation
- cash back your stolen cash from rydujasa account (if you said that they know, it wasn't you, who lose money to him)

In today world, tracking computers via IP/MAC address is not too hard. And I wonder, why they allow to log into your account from IP in another country? Even Google first ask you to allow login from different IP, different location or different device. PS should implement "safe device" and "safe locations" and you should first approve that to login, if you do it first time. And all unsafe locations/devices/IPs should be banned until approve.

     
  11-Aug-18, 00:05   #14
  0 
erru9107 
Joined: Oct '11
Location: Sweden
Age: 27 (M)
Posts: 1083
Yeah I think that Poker Stars should be able to do much more then what they are doing to help you! It's easy using todays technology to find out who did this to you and they have more then enough information to actually take action against these people. But I do see things from their perspective as well. I haven't went through their ToS but I'm fairly sure they have something about that it's your own responsibility to protect your password and they aren't responsible yaddi yaddi yadda.

     
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